This film is an absolute masterpiece

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i love that someone who hasn't even seen the film has left a long philosophical discussion of its themes here.
i can't stand this movie. i'm studying it. the more i think about it, the more i hate it, and the more i think that's a good thing. solondz says, 'my movies aren't for everyone. especially those who like them.' Solondz, essentially, hates his fans. he doesn't want us to like him or his films, he wants to push us further and further away from him. i think he would hate to have it called art, because really he knows it's just foul. it doesn't just push the envelope, it jerks off all over the envelope then plasters it on your screen with the goop. i am in two completely different minds about this movie. part of me likes the deadpan black humour but i didn't find it at all funny the first time i watched it.
Stuart: is it someone else?
Joy: no, it's just you.
brilliant. maplewood discussing masturbation with his son, whom he later admits he jerks off over? disgusting. i don't know whether i hate this movie or respect it, maybe both, but i know i feel very, very strongly about it and that's better than i can say for most movies.

I think we're seeing two kinds of people on this board,
there are people who watched this movie and hated how it made them feel and mistake that for hating the movie, and then there are people (just as myself) who felt just as f u ck ed up after seeing this as the first group of folks, but would prefer to have a movie affect them in a visceral and lasting way for better or for worse, than waste two hours of their life on something they'll never think about again.
But because there are no "It was ok, I guess" posts, one would have to conclude that it is a brilliantly written,acted, directed, edited piece of art. Cinema is art, just keep that in mind, blockbusters are junkfood for your head, this was the most bitter of greens. F U k ki n delicious

Some adults want to experience the whole range of emotions - not just mad, glad, and sad.
Someone's at the door

I think the idea behind the film was that all people, regardless of how sick or depraved they might be, want basically the same thing: to be happy in their own way. I think the reason a lot of people have a hard time with this flick is that these twisted people are portrayed not as demons, but as what they are: people. It's easy to take a child molester and make him look like a depraved psychopath. It's much harder and much more daring (not to mention interesting) to show him as a human, a family man who may even have a few likable qualities. In approaching these characters from a different perspective, you get a unique look at the human condition. This isn't a film about making you feel horrible, if anything it's unifying. If you are too shortsighted to appreciate that, well then that's a shame.

"Its not educational, entertaining, or enlightening"
Yeah right, I never want to see this mover again but it's all three of those (although two of those are synonyms and I think you tried too hard to get that third E word)

Of course they are Human beings , who doubts that? Just very bad kind of human beings. And it is now a known fact that nobody can suspect them by their looks. It can be the very nice down-to earth-family man next door just like Bill in this film.

I completely agree with 'kurtblirgrusom'.
That is pretty much exactly what I was going to say.
I absolutely LOVED this movie!!!

Everyone has some good in them. Everyone has a soul and needs a chance at redemption and well, there is one exeption: moralists.

Yes, yes. You are a good christian and care about love and peace. It doesn't matter if things like child abuse, insanity or loneliness exists, because they don't REALLY exist in your world
This movie is educational and enlightening because it portrays characters in a completely different and interesting view; phedofiles CAN be human beings too.
It is entertaining because it tells tragic, touching stories.
If you can't handle the truth, don't bother to start a discussion. If you want to critizise ANY piece of art or ANY story, you have to be open minded and ignore things like "correct" morals and political or religious codes.

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Thank you.
"You're a disease, and I'm the cure!" - Marion "Cobra" Cobretti

Typical pig-ignorant conservative nonsense: "All muslims are terrorists, anyone who disagrees with me is a sick pervert, only conservatives are good, liberals are all evil scum, blah blah blah blah. Could you be any more pathetically tedious and boring?

Epitome of dumbed down liberal group-speak, if you're against something that liberals like, like a movie portraying gays having sex just to shock the audience, then you are a hidden gay(PS I have no problem with gay film,just using an example).
Liberals answers are so predictable.

Muslims want to blow up everyone not Muslim.
They want to blow us up more-so because we have such a strong military presence in the middle east. Keep your irrational opinions to yourself.
You are so vehemently against this film, it makes me wonder if you don't struggle suppress pedophile-like urges, or something similar, yourself.

It's funny that the scum who justify this film are exactly why Muslims want to blow us up.

Anyone who would consider of putting anyone outside the human race shouldn't be considered a human, more of a monster for not having a soul. Stop thinking about your pathetic views of the world, you don't know jack!

mjktig2: You say that understanding is a bad thing.
That's an example of where you are as a nation and as a people.

This post is a perfect example of where we are going as nation and as a people. We want to understand everyone even the sick twisted pedophile and rapist. What do you mean a "realistic light"? They are monsters and that is the reality. They have shown the world that they cannot exist among the rest of us and they need to be eliminated. Everyone has a chance to be good and do the right thing but those who are like the character in this film should not be allowed to live among the civilized. You act as though the character is coming out as a homosexual by telling his son what he is. What he is is a piece of garbage and nothing else. He has thrown his humanity away and should not be considered human. Anyone who can identify with murderers, rapists, pedophiles, etc. is as morally barren as those who commit these crimes.

tl;dr
Revelation Below!!!!:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

YOU USE FAR TOO MANY INVERTED COMMAS. IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE MOVIE WHY EVEN BOTHER POSTING ANYTHING?

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Hmmmm.
Interesting.
I haven't actually seen the film.
However, what is interesting is that the only reason I came across the description was because I typed 'happiness' into google to see what it had to say for itself - since 'happiness' is obviously the 'main quest' in people's lives - whatever that consists of - so therefore to discover that in a sense the film was about that quest but not actually being 'fulfilled' and then seeing people's responses to it - ranging from 'love to hate' is quite interesting in itself.
After all.
Some people say they 'loved it' because of the humour element.
Some people didn't like the 'humour' and therefore they hated it.
In the freudian sense - humour is about 'laughing at taboos' therefore getting over the 'problems' and 'depression' that is normally associated with 'wrong things' or 'taboos', so that some sort of external viewing process can be enabled so that some form of evolution or healing can take place.
However - sometimes humour in itself can be 'taboo' i.e. when it is inappropriate or insensitive or at the expense of others, rather than 'with' that person or 'subject'.
It's all a question of degrees and how much people identify with different sides of the 'argument' or topic in discussion.
It all boils down to whether or not the 'humour' is 'enlightening' or whether it is in the best interests of everyone or whether it is at someone's expense.
Having a sense of humour about oneself helps primarily - but sometimes we look for more sensitivity in life - and to have too much of a sense of humour about ourself can also sometimes be about self-humiliation.
If this film has no 'answers' to the quest for 'happiness' one could say 'what is the point' in watching it, if it has no 'meaningful purpose' behind it. Maybe the point is that there are 'conventional plans for happiness' that we are programmed with when we are born, and then we discover that things don't quite work out like that - so therefore to be more enlightened in order to see the 'happiness' ie 'humour' even in the failures and the tragedy etc. but also not to wallow in them; i.e. to view objectively and to use this to discover new alternative strategies to move on, is something positive in itself.
It reminds me once of a song that I once witnessed being performed in a live acoustic music club.
The 2 performers were astounding and professional standard, considering the ocassion, which was full of amateurs, and ranging from one extreme to the other of the musical spectrum.
The girl in the duo was beautiful and the guy played his guitar in a classical jazz flamenco fusion style that was exquisite.
The song was a melancholic description of a girl who had had many troubles of varying descriptions in her life. The song was poignant and meaningful in its depth.
But the more that the song continued, with each verse, the drama and turmoil just seemed to get to a point that there was so much going on - that it was too much. Then it just became ridiculous. Then everyone started laughing. Giggling first, then more and more, the performers then got annoyed, and it was like the audience were naughty children not appreciating the seriousness, no longer empathising with the tragedy of the song, and then the musicians got quite stroppy.
But in a sense, one could say that to laugh in the face of adversity is surely a prime necessity, to have an ironic sense of humour, and first and foremost to cultivate a sense of humour at oneself is the most important, but also to remember that if we are too serious noone will take us seriously, but also if we are not serious enough, then it goes the same way too. It's all a question of balance. But what about the poor girl and her tragic circumstances? Did anyone take her seriously and work out a sustainable management strategy to work out how to alleviate her suffering and woes? What does it say about the audience that they didn't care any more about her suffering?
The same in this film. If you empathise with the characters too much, maybe it is depressing. If you don't empathise with them, and it is all too much, and therefore you view it as an over-stated 'ironic' black comedy then it is humourous.
But does the film offer any solutions or potential for enlightenment in the quest for actual 'happiness' in relationships - or does it just consider the break down of relationships as purely fodder for entertainment. Is it childish or is there method in the madness? Is there faith and hope and a glimmering of light at the end of the tunnel?