You think massive plothloles is going up?

Having watched Returns recently, I think the visual production is the only part of it that's aged well at all. Still better then the DCEU but I'd hardly blame Nolan for that since I think the storytelling quality shifted UP with his movies rather than down.
Doctor Strange: One of Marvel's Best

Batman and Robin, the worst film ever made
Certainly IMO the worst superhero film ever made.
Edit:
Should add I've not seen that last Fantastic Four movie!
"A big ball of wibbly wobbly, timey wimey stuff"
The Tenth Doctor explains all.

lol please, Batman and Robin is far from being the worst film ever made.

Your credibility takes a hit when you try to defend Batman and Robin, the worst film ever made.

You mean how did we go from campy movies to mature ones? Hater please.
I'm the thing that keeps you up at night, the evil that haunts every dark corner of your mind

That sounds more like TDkR. Only it's unwtatchable cuz it's too messy.

Batman Returns is a depressing and ugly mess. It's sort of watchable, but it's a fairly mediocre film. Time to take the nostalgia glasses off.

I don't understand how you think that way.

I think the Dark Knight is a good movie too but not a great Batman movie. I hated what they did with Two-Face, he's my fav Batman villain and they just squandered his potential in the worst way. It's unforgivable to me. I have other problems with it too but honestly it just wasn't as well made as Begins was. It lost the feeling and atmosphere the first film built well enough to be recognized as Batman film.
It was interesting to see and now that it's done, I'd like to see something more like Batman. Snyder, did great with Batman's action's but even he didn't quite capture the essence I was looking for. It doesn't help that Affleck made a terrible Batman either.

Well I actually love Batman Begins I think its a really good origin story but its not nearly as great as Returns.
Ditto. The Dark Knight is my #1 Batman movie, but Batman Returns and Batman '89 are my 2 and 3.
Nolan did a decent job grounding Bruce Wayne but it does spoil all the fantasy elements of Batman's world
I loved that approach of putting Batman in the 'real world. It was interesting to see - but I agree that Batman does need his fantasy elements.
"A big ball of wibbly wobbly, timey wimey stuff"
The Tenth Doctor explains all.

couldn't disagree more.

Fascinating.
The faux gothic architecture and neo-noir atmosphere is waht makes Gotham such an inviting world IMO.
DRRROOOPPP OUUTTTT OFFF LIFE WIIITH BOOOOONG IN HAAAAANNND.

I don't think its suitable.

why not?

I never liked how Gotham looked in those cartoons. Its a damn good movie doh.

I think Mask Of The Phantasm is a great origin story.

Well I actually love Batman Begins I think its a really good origin story but its not nearly as great as Returns.
Nolan did a decent job grounding Bruce Wayne but it does spoil all the fantasy elements of Batman's world and that's the problem.

I agree, Batman Returns would be impossible to do today. The most we can do is just stop perpetuating this deification of Nolan and just tell the truth, we haven't had a good Batman universe since Burton's.

Ya, Nolan's influence definitely ruined the potential of how Batman movies should be but How many Directors are there these days that could get away with what Burton did back then?
How many want to even make a Batman film?

I personally liked the Nolan films better than the Burton films. I know a lot of people will disagree.
Metallica, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, and My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic fan

Batman (1966) is superior in every way.

It's not a masterpiece, I love it but it's not a patch on the first, looks like it's shot at Winter Wonderland, there's a bit of a story and hardly any action and a massive anti climax.
Batman 89 is superior in every way.

Batman returns is ugly looking trash that's only liked because it's old