Nina Simone controversy = Political correctness has jumped the shark
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — Zoe Saldana
Sweet_and_Lowdown77 — 10 years ago(March 02, 2016 09:51 AM)
These are some Twitter reactions to Zoe playing Nina:
"@Dani_Burnss The fact Hollywood can't cast a dark skin woman for a movie about Nina Simone is disgusting."
"@NaturallyTiss Boycott this Nina Simone 'biopic' if you real. God knows Nina would be disgusted."
"@e_alexjung I know Zoe has responsibility for taking the part of Nina Simone, but you know there was some white guy who thought this was A GREAT IDEA"
"@___PantheR The colorism of getting a light skinned actress to play Nina Simone when you could've actually casted a dark skinned actress/singer."
"@DamoneWilliams Nina Simone was a dark-skinned, thick-lipped, wide-nosed, nappy-haired Black woman whose career and life were directly affected by ALL that"
Basically, folks in the African American community are upset because Zoe isn't "black" enough. It doesn't matter that Zoe's a great actresses. It doesn't matter that the film is probably only getting made because of Zoe. Her name being part of such hits as Guardians of the Galaxy Star Trek & Avatar probably allowed the filmmakers to raise the money to make the film. Everyone forgets the movie industry is a business and not a charity.
The African American community doesn't want the best actor possible to play Nina. They ONLY care about the color of her skin.
They are JUDGING by the color of the skin.
Yes, Racism is alive and well in the America.
In the history of biopics, very rarely does the artist portraying the subject look exactly like the artist. Steve Jobs WISHES he looked like Michael Fassbender. Anthony Hopkins endured 4+ hours of painstaking MU FX daily to portray Nixon and Hitchcock. Will Smith looks nothing like Ali or Dr. Bennet Omalu. Ever see June Carter Cash? Does she look like Reese Witherspoon?
You find the best actor for the role and if their performance is great, you don't see those differences. For crying out loud, when England first started doing stage, women were not allowed to act so men played the parts. A man played Juliet.
It's called "acting" for a reason. The outrage needs to stop. Seriously, you want to know why Trump's going to be president? It's that a majority of the country is tired of the nonsensical scandal politically correct BS. Instead of celebrating that Nina Simone is getting a biopic with a major star, folks are pissed she's not "black" enough?!?!
My goodness, all those complaining deserve President Trump. -
Christina91 — 10 years ago(March 02, 2016 03:35 PM)
Well said. This "political correctness" has really gotten out of control. I just read that for her role in The Danish Girl, Alicia Vikander wore make up to make hda0er appear whiter, as the character she plays was from Scandinavia. You didn't hear a word about that on Twitter did you? But they make a black actress appear blacker and people lose their minds.
There are real problems in the world people!! This is not one of them. -
beaucheri33 — 10 years ago(March 02, 2016 08:37 PM)
I think people are mad for reasons other than zoe not being "black" enough actually the fact that she had to wear dark makeup and a fake nose is proof enough that her features are nothing like simone's but that's besides the point there are so many other actresses that could have been a better choice to play simone..but zoe was picked because of politics, all Hollywood cares about is $$$$, saldana has proven herself capable of being a box office star, and that's what they want
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Sweet_and_Lowdown77 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 09:22 AM)
First off, this film is NOT a Hollywood production. The film is being made by Ealing Studios and Londinum Films, both are London based production companies.
So "Hollywood" isn't involved in this.
Second, Nicole Kidman wore a fake nose in THE HOURS to play Virginia Woolf. She also wore heavy makeup to hide her natural freckles since Virgina did not have freckles. She won an academy award. Anthony Hopkins wore a fake nose and chin and hair piece to play NIXON, he also wore a fat suit, fake nose and bald cap to play HITCHCOCK. Daniel Day Lewis wore a fake nose and chin to play LINCOLN an won an academy award.
Wearing prosthetics and having additional MU is common in filmmaking. Very rarely to actors look like the person they're playing. To say Zoe shouldn't play Nina b/c she needs a fake nose & MU is ignorant.
While it's entirely possible Zoe got the part because of resume, that's how most actors get their roles. I'm sure this London company making the film needed a "star" to play Simone to get financing. That's extremely common. Film companies aren't running a charity. Films are made to make money.
But you're assuming that's the ONLY reason. Zoe's incredibly talented. The events of this film appear to cover Nina's rise to fame when she was in her early 30's. Zoe was 36 when making this film. She plays younger. Seems to fit perfectly age wise. And she's talented.
But that's not enough. You want to find someone who is all those things AND dark skinned with EXACT physical features to Nina?
My goodness. -
PeggyFromMannix — 10 years ago(March 05, 2016 06:29 AM)
I think people are mad for reasons other than zoe not being "black" enough actually the fact that she had to wear dark makeup and a fake nose is proof enough that her features are nothing like simone's but that's besides the point there are so many other actresses that could have been a better choice to play simone..but zoe was picked because of politics, all Hollywood cares about is $$$$, saldana has 2000proven herself capable of being a box office star, and that's what they want
I completely agree. Although I like Zoe, IMHO, she isn't right for the role. However, just like you pointed out, this biopic would never have been greenlit if a name actress was not playing Nina Simone. I think Viola Davis would've been a better choice but Hollywood has more faith in Zoe's bankability. Ditto for the upcoming Anita Hill movie starring Kerry Washington, whom I consider miscast. Ultimately, as we all know, the real color at the center of this controversy is green.
Keep the faith.
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Lightrend — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 10:26 AM)
Political correctness may seem pathetic and even counter productive at a glance, but if you cant identify it as a symptom of a real problem, and see that it is clearly a "work in progress" - a bump in the road to societal evolution - then you are just not
competent
enough to speak about this.
Of course Hollywood is "white-washed". And of course it is partly due to consumer demand - DUH - we live in a society that has been fighting for years to get rid of the systemic racism that is - of course - still present today.
This is just like with prohibition; we banned drugs because Nancy strangled her kids while high on weed, and consequently ruined it for the rest of us. As in the case with Nancy, you are completely allowed to cry about your culture being ruined by bad actors who are only being cast as a societal measure. But since this sht has an actual impact on society we dont care about your experience in the theater. This needs to be regulated by people who have the merits needed to actually understand the problem and impact society. Which is good, because it will free up more of your time to handle things that
you
excel at, what ever that is -
Sweet_and_Lowdown77 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 11:30 AM)
With all due respect, this isn't evolution. This is devolution.
The outcry against Zoe is unjust. It's being made by a community that seems to have appointed themselves the judge, jury & executioner of what constitutes "Black".
Zoe's being criticized, judged, not for her talent but by what she looks like and the color of her skin. Isn't that racism?
So Malcolm X wasn't black because he's not as "dark skinned" as Martin Luther King? PR & DR Black people aren't real Black because they're not African American? South American Blacks aren't real blacks?
Do you think a bigot wearing a KKK sheet cares what shade of Black you are before they discriminate?
I'll guarantee you Zoe's had to endure all the same struggles any Black girl of her has had to endure. I'm sure she's lost out on roles that went to other actresses.
I also love how folks continue to bash "hollywood". This isn't a Hollywood film. It's being made by a British Company. No Hollywood studios are involved.
I believe there is a difference between being politically correct, in terms of referring to the "disabled" instead of the previous nomenclatures used to describe them.
I have no idea what your point about Prohibition is, but you and others are judging Zoe and the filmmakers before anyone's seen the film. Do you know for a fact the filmmakers don't have the merits to tell this stor7ecy? Has anyone thought for a second that Zoe was the best ACTRESS for the role? That she was the right age an gave the best audition? Do folks understand that filmmaking is a business and films are social experiments?
It's hard to make a movie. Really hard. Even harder to make a low budget Bio Pic. I'll guarantee you no one on the production is making a ton of money. I'll guarantee you Zoe is making a fraction of what she normally would.
Why? Because she wanted to play the role. Because she had a passion to tell Nina's story. These filmmakers probably spent years of their lives making this film.
People need to stop protesting stuff and start living life. There are real issues to protest. There are real injustices in the world. This isn't one of them. The degree of Zoe's skin tone is NOT a real issue. -
morpheusownsall — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 11:49 AM)
First offZoe is not a great actress. Uzo Aduba iswho is an emmy-award winner and actually looks closer to Nina Simone.
Second, Zoe is part of the racial hollywood cycle of giving us the go-to "black" actress. First off it was Halle Berry now it's Zoe. So it does rub people the wrong way when she is put in all the "black" roles, when she does not look like or represent quintissential blackness.
Third of allthis is an important story abo2000ut race and identity and the hardship Nina Simone went through based on her image. Zoe does not get that and will never get that. So you have to pick someone who can identify with that.
LastlySteve Carrell having prosthetics to look closer to a fellow white man is very different from Zoe darkening her skin which brings up the horrors and history of blackface to play a role.
People, whites mainly, are missing the racial aspect of it because they just don't understand. -
Sweet_and_Lowdown77 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 03:28 PM)
First off, this is your opinion re: who is a "better" actress. And Uzo Aruba might have similar physical traits to Nina, who's to say she could play the part?
Second, this film is NOT a Hollywood production. The film is being produced independently by 2 British Companies IN England.
And it doesn't matter the "shade" Zoe is black.
Third, maybe wait until you see the film before saying Zoe "doesn't get it".
Lastly, Carell's skin was also lightened. Nicole Kidman had all her freckles covered over to portray Virginia Woolf. Both had prosthetics. Every actor filmed wears makeup. To suggest Zoe applying a darker shade of makeup to get the skin color more in line with Nina's to "Blackface" is bizarre and just silly.
Blackface was used to keep any blacks from acting. They would cast white people and color their faces. Zoe is black.
Who decided that only people that can trace their roots to Africa are "Black". By the way, all mankind traces its roots back to Africa, but I digress.
So, you, as a rep of the "Black" community are saying that men and women of color from South America, DR, England, Asia and PR are not "black"? You think the folks in white sheets cared what shade of black folks were before they tried to lynch them?
Are you saying Malcolm X wasn't really black because he was light-skinned?
As a white person, no, I'll never truly understand the plight of men and women of color, but I do know that the members of the Black community I know and call friends have relayed to me that all they've ever wanted was to be judged for WHO they are. Not the color of their skin.
Yet you want to judge Zoe on the color of her skin.
think about that. -
Ladonia84 — 10 years ago(April 04, 2016 08:17 AM)
Black is more than a color it is a culture. SO an Asian with black skin could not play Nina by covering 1908up their Asian features. Saldana portraying a Black American Icon by covering up her features a blatant sign that the issues about identity, something Nina advocated for, within the Black community were ignore. And let me ask why do you think there aren't more well known black actresses? Why was Lupita rise to stardom so exceptional? is it bc dark skin woman can't act or nvm they aren't appealing to mass audiences?
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AtheistRevolution — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 11:52 AM)
Zoe Saldana is the best actress possible? That's a joke.They should have cast Lupita Nyong'o.Racism has always been alive in America.And Zoe Saldana wouldn't be anywhere if she wasn't light skin.And Trump is leading in the polls because they were already racist malcontents that wanted to blame all their problems on others.Every psychotic leader uses that to gain power. They didn't need political correctness to be racist for most of this countries history.They found someone that wants to bring back open racism and love it.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful. -
namedjay93 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 12:49 PM)
This is one of the most intellectually dishonest posts I've ever seen on IMDB, and that's saying something.
Colorism is the center of this controversy, which is a complicated issue you clearly took no time to educate yourself about.
Maybe understand what is actually being discussed next time before making a fool of yourself with several exhaustingly long rants that somehow never managed to hit on the issue at hand even once. -
ChloeBird808 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 01:36 PM)
I love Zoe, I really do, but people are pi$$ed as there are a few actresses for this role that they could have chosen who would have been more suited to the role; Uzo Aduba and Viola Davis or if they wanted to take a bigger risk, India Aire.
I don't even really blame the casting directors I truly blame Zoe for choosing a role she's clearly not suitable for. -
starryeyedgirl1 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 06:15 PM)
In this day and age, in the black, Asian, Latino communities there is such thing as colourism/shadism. Lighter has always been preferred. People have been made to feel like crap for being dark.
Political Correctness, my behind. You know nothing.
In "Hollywood", lighter-skinned or fairer black actresses are getting more/better roles than darker skinned actresses. Please don't pretend this is not the case.
I don't see no dark-skinned actresses getting cast in parts meant for lighter skinned blacks. The Lovings (a movie about a light-skinned black women married to a white man) just finished filming. No way they would have cast someone like Gabrielle Union or Aja Naomi King (only dark skinned actresses I know who are not too old and with somewhat of a name).
Or even "Belle" with Gugu Mbatha-Raw, but cast Keke Palmer and lighten her skin with makeup. No f-ing way. It's just an excuse to not use dark women. You are just to blind to see the blatant colourism/shadism. Hollywood definitely has a preference. They are black women like Paula Patton, Halle Berry, Alexandra Shipp, Gugu Mbatha-Raw, Aurora Perrineau, etc. And if they want to get real close, they'll use someone like Zoe. Not completely light skinned, but not too dark, with acceptable hair and features. They can pretend like that's not as far as they are willing to go.
The argument isn't that she is not "black" enough, it is that she is not the same "black" as Nina. She is a tad lighter with different features. She is a freaking Afro-Latina for Pete's sake. And there is no way in hell she was the best actress for the job.
This kind of casting is problematic. It adds to the notion that black/dark-skinned women are not good enough, but that lighter women are. Also it is apparent that dark skinned men don't have this issue in "Hollywood". Men like Idris Elba, Denzel Washington, Jamie Foxx, Don Cheadle, Will Smith, Morris Chestnut etc.
Only non-black people classify all black people as the same, when clearly they are not, if certain types are still struggling for their type of "black" to be accepted.
This love will be your downfall -
Sweet_and_Lowdown77 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 07:14 PM)
Well, I know that this wasn't a Hollywood production. It is 100% financed by a British company and produced by 2 companies in England. This is 100% independent of Hollywood.
So saying "In Hollywood" in regards to this film is irrelevant.
Colorism and shadism is just another form of racism. It's an excuse by a minority in the African American community to keep racism alive. Do you honestly think folks wearing the White Sheets cared about shades of Blackness before they lynched folks?
I'll guarantee you that Zoe's faced prejudice because of the color of her skin.
Malcolm X was a light7ec-skinned Black Man is he less "Black"?
And the argument shouldn't be that Zoe's not the same "black" it should be is she the most talented artist to bring Nina to life on screen. She's being judged by the color of her skin and not her talent. You're judging her based on her skin color. Do you have proof that this was the casting process? Isn't it possible that she earned the role based on her talent?
Casting is REALLY hard. Every director will tell you, they'd rather have THE BEST ACTOR AVAILABLE rather than someone who looks exactly like the person. You can alter the appearance of someone to look more like someone. But you can't invent talent.
I never said "all black people are the same", but all black people or every shade have faced prejudice because of the color of their skin. "Dark Black" people aren't alone.
IMO, Zoe's a very talented actress. She's paid her dues. She's built up a tremendous resume mixed with drama, action, comedy, she's showed great range in films like INFINITELY POLAR BEAR and even brought a Blue Alien to life in AVATAR. I think she deserves the benefit of the doubt. Zoe's smart. I'm sure she knew the challenges of not only playing Nina Simone from an emotional standpoint but probably knew there would be doubters out there. IMO, she's brave. She's taking a risk.
And perhaps there is a certain level of comfort financiers feel with Zoe. But I'm sure the comfort is more because she's a star and less because she's a little lighter than Nina. I mean, if the financiers were truly concerned with her "shade" of black and they wanted a "lighter" shade, then why would they have her wear darker makeup to darken the skin? Doesn't this defeat your point? I mean if the goal is to cast a light skinned black person because they don't want a dark skinned black person, why make her dark skinned? -
starryeyedgirl1 — 10 years ago(March 03, 2016 08:54 PM)
I put "Hollywood" in quotations, because I didn't mean the actual place, but the industry.
Colorism and shadism is just another form of racism. It's an excuse by a minority in the African American community to keep racism alive.
It's not an excuse, but because Caucasians set the beauty standards. There are also non poc who will only prefer a black actress because she is biracial or has features that are accepted by Europeans. That "She's not like other black actresses" or "what is she mixed with" crap for women like Kerry Washington, Sanaa Lathan, Rihanna, etc.
It is also not JUST in African American communities, don't be so ignorant and do your research.
I'll guarantee you that Zoe's faced prejudice because of the color of her skin.
Malcolm X was a light-skinned Black Man is he less "Black"?
No doubt she has.
I never said Zoe was not black, but an Afro-Latina (Dominican) is not the same as a black person from Kenya or Somalia. (If you believe this, then it's basically like saying all black people are the same) Do Rosario Dawson and Lupita N'yongo look like they can play sisters from the same parents?
I also believe one of Zoe's parent is not black, just a tanned Latina. I may be wrong.
I never said "all black people are the same", but all black people or every shade have faced prejudice because of the color of their skin. "Dark Black" people aren't alone.
You are right, but I am specifically talking about in the industry. They are definitely marginalized the most. Let's not pretend they aren't. Specifically females. Even worse if they don't have nice hair, small lips and noses.
I mean, if the financiers were truly concerned with her "shade" of black and they wanted a "lighter" shade, then why would they have her wear darker makeup to darken the skin? Doesn't this defeat your point? I mean if the goal is to cast a light skinned black person because they don't want a dark skinned black person, why make her dark skinned?
Because her "black" is acceptable. Also they knew if they didn't darken her, there would be backlash. More so than there is already. They probably didn't foresee this backlash because they thought she was "dark enough".
This love will be your downfall