Ingmar Bergman on Orson Welles
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Byrdz — 10 years ago(September 30, 2015 09:22 PM)
I saw this
Ingmar Bergman on Orson Welles
and popped over to see what INGRID Bergman had to say about Kane Imagine my surprise !!! It just didn't really sound like Ingrid.
Time for new glasses
or at least un-tinted ones, eh ? -
cyninbend-149-610489 — 9 years ago(May 11, 2016 12:56 AM)
I did the same thingand thought how bizarre, Ingrid Bergman attacking Orson Wellesthen realized my error too.
I appreciate Citizen Kane more since I watched the TCM series on German Expressionism, the films of the Weimar Republic. Seems to me, Welles was quite influenced by themand much of the drama and use of light and shadow that make Citizen Kane what they love so much came from that influence. (And the concept of doing this to Hearst tickles many.)
But the movie falls short as a story-telling exercise, in my opinion. It was 1941, after alland movies had grown a lot in the preceding 2 or 3 decades. If Citizen Kane had been made in 1931, I'd be more impressed. It's so rough and seems experimentalwhere Casablanca seems so sophisticated, smooththe difference between what a boy made and what an adult with experience did. Even The Maltese Falcon told a tighter (if confusing at least at first) story and exhibited more discipline. And the same goes for Suspicion. Gone With The Wind, The Wizard Of Oz, Sullivan's Travels, Love Affair, The Philadelphia Story And other movies of that time told incredibly beautiful or dramatic stories, although they were taken from books, short stories or novelettesOf Mice And Men, The Grapes Of Wrath, Rebecca, Ninotchka. So while this is certainly an awesome movie, it's in a class of movies where so many of this time are amazing stories, fantastic story-tellingfrightening, involving, witty, or funny. Some other titles from those years: The Great Dictator, Mr. Smith Goes To Washington, The Hunchback Of Notre Dame, Sgt. York, Wuthering Heights, My Favorite Wife, Dark Victory, and High Sierra. And many more.
If you take the influences of German Expressionism from Citizen Kane, would people think it was better than these other films? I think that and the chutzpah of making the main character have so much in common with one of the richest and most powerful Americans are why the movie received so much praise. Not that it was so stunning a work of movie-making, or story-telling, or acting, directing, etc. Other movies entertained more, told better stories or told the stories better. -
Byrdz — 9 years ago(May 11, 2016 03:56 AM)
RE: Not getting the joke. It Happens a LOT. Except for "mean humor" it is sadly lacking on the IMDbs.
RE: Weimer influence. Interesting thoughts.
RE: the rest
All wonderful films.
I am apparently somewhat of a loner on the IMDb. I still watch films as single films and don't compare them. I like Kane. I have actually seen all that you mentioned and like them as well. Some of them are even in my huge list of re-watch over and over films.
BUT, I don't "get" the need to compare and put down via "this was better than that" etc. all over the boards.
I saw Kane in a museum showing and had zero knowledge of it loved it .. when WOAH at the big ending reveal . perhaps that's what it was like for viewers when it came out and for new non-film buffs lucky enough to find it with its reputation an unknown ?
Not arguing with you, btw. Just two different styles of film watching. Found your post quite interesting. -
Hythlodaeus — 10 years ago(November 21, 2015 05:37 PM)
Bergman films are definitely an acquired taste. I never really got into them. I think Bergman did that one where the knight played chess with the devil - I liked that one but all the others were frustratingly subtle (even though I love Max Von Sidow and it was great to see him young in those old films).
I would expect to Bergman, Wells is far too big-screen Hollywood - sort of like what Wells would probably say about Michael Bay movies today.
What hump? -
doug65oh — 9 years ago(October 05, 2016 08:43 PM)
Maybe this will help a bit - from
http://www.wellesnet.com/orson-welles-vs-ingmar-bergman/
Scroll and you'll find it. -
TopFrog — 9 years ago(November 18, 2016 07:05 PM)
Let's return the favor. Orson Welles on Ingmar Bergman:
I don't condemn that very northern, very Protestant world of artists like Bergman; it's just not where I live. The Sweden I like to visit is a lot of fun. But Bergman's Sweden always reminds me of something Henry James said about Ibsen's Norway - that it was full of the odor of spiritual paraffin. How I sympathize with that! I share neither Bergmans interests nor his obsessions. He's far more foreign to me than the Japanese.
