Question About Harry Lime's Famous Quote
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bhoover247 — 14 years ago(December 20, 2011 07:08 AM)
Thanks for the info about the quote from Whistler. Since Whistler died before World War I he must not have cared that much about Switzerland not taking sides. Maybe the Swiss bankers never bought his paintings. I wonder if anybody ever asked Whistler for any additional comment about his quote.
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pmiano100 — 14 years ago(December 20, 2011 10:37 AM)
As a West Point dropout and expatriate American who lived for years in Europe, I don't think Whistler was much for taking sides either. I was led to believe that he thought the Swiss were materialistic and had made few if any great contributions to the arts.
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matt_shade — 13 years ago(October 19, 2012 06:56 AM)
I am Swedish and fully understand your stance on our hypocrisy. We let our politicians and top businessmen get away with far too much.
I don't know what this gravy you're talking about, though. Brown mincedmeat-tomatosauce-mix for pasta I know well but for meatballs?
But that's just me. -
pmiano100 — 13 years ago(October 19, 2012 09:52 AM)
Let me explain. There is a dish served in Chinese restaurants in the US called chop suey. It was invented by a Chinese chef living in New York, and is not well known in China.
Similarly, there is a dish called Swedish meatballs. It consists of tiny meatballs mixed with brown noodles in a despicable brown gravy. I am of Italian heritage and I consder it an atrocity against good meatballs and pasta. Most Americans believe it originated in your country. Is it possible that this atrocity against good eating is not really Swedish? If so, I apologize. But if it really is Swedish, may your nation be beset by the seven deadly Biblical plagues, including the death of all first born male children. -
matt_shade — 13 years ago(October 19, 2012 04:48 PM)
Whaaa?
In Sweden, Swedish meatballs are roughly pingpong-sized or larger. The brown gravy is poured but usually spiked with seasoning or a bit of red wine or the like if it's with some form of potatoes. If it's meatballs with pasta, I've never seen that brown gravy anywhere near it. If spaghetti, that's where a good red tomatosauce (or ketchup in a pinch) comes in. If noodles, probably some curry sauce or the like, though I don't think I've ever had noodles with meatballs.
Brown gravy on noodles eeuuch!
But that's just me. -
jd-276 — 13 years ago(November 10, 2012 06:43 PM)
At least the Swiss do not hypocritically and self-righteously boast about how peaceful and progressive they are, like the God-accursed Swedes.
That's because they are not as progressive. BOTH countries make money out of war but a major cultural difference between the two is that Sweden considers itself a country whereas Switzerland identifies as a collective of Cantons.
Can you please give some relevant examples of Sweden being self-righteous? Or is it that you just don't like their gravy?
Meanwhile, back to the original point.
The ad libbed quote (which is apparently a paraphrase of Whistler) is used as an example of the same justification that any number of dictators have used to make themselves feel cleaner. From Hitler to Stalin to Franco, dictators have always used a "survival of the fittest" motive to justify what they saw as progress, at the same time maintaining their position at the top.
In this respect, Lime is a reminder of the types of people the world though it had rid itself of four years previously and the reason Vienna is still in ruins. -
pmiano100 — 13 years ago(November 10, 2012 08:35 PM)
I consider the Swiss far more progressive. It was the Swedes who were warlike until the Russians kicked their butts in the 18th Century. I freely admitted the Swiss make money out of war, but they are not hypocrites like the (CENSORED) Swedes, may their Volvos all get flat tires.
- The constant boasting of the late Olof Palme.
- Their bragging about staying neutral in both world wars, while they sold weapons to both sides.
- Their constant criticism of American racism, while not admitting to their own problems with African and Middle Eastern immigrants.
- That lousy brown gravy on Swedish meatballs alone justifies their nuclear destruction if it's theirs. A recent Swedish correspondent has told me it is not.
I could go on, but why bother?
I assume you mean Vienna was still in ruins in 1949. So was most of Europe. It took until about 1960 for Western Europe to recover from WWII. Eastern Europe took much longer. Lime's type still exists in abundant numbers, as I'm sure you know.
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jd-276 — 13 years ago(November 11, 2012 03:03 AM)
I have lived in Switzerland. My ex was Swiss. Switzerland is an incredibly conservative country, if indeed it really functions as a country at all. The Swiss concept of federalism is very loose.
Are you actually serious about the relevance of the 18th Century to this topic? I reckon you're just uncomfortable with the idea that a country which advocates policies and ideals like those of Sweden could be successful. On top of that, Sweden had an edge in some military technologies in the 1960s to 1980s which made the US feel pretty uneasy to the point of threats of a trade embargo. That's how childish it got. In the early 1990s they sold the US a lot of their datalink technology but they made sure they got something out of it in return. Apparently that didn't go down very well either, especially since they now have the technology to see some of your stealth aircraft (so does Australia).
But I digress- Palme was not representative of all Sweden and many Swedes were embarrassed by him. He dared criticise you over Vietnam. Should he be obliged to stay quiet over that? Was the US above criticism? He was divisive and not very straight. Every country has its political wild men, including yours;
- Same could be said for Switzerland and Switzerland did not have a very good record for handling refugees or Nazi money;
- What problems did Sweden have with "immogrants" (
sic
) that they turned a blind eye to? When did they criticise the US for racism and why are you so thin-skinned about it? Wasn't it justified? - Irrelevant. Kind of fun but I'm not going any further with it.
Indeed.
It took until 1989 for Europe to recover, Western Europe included.
Done with you.
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pmiano100 — 12 years ago(August 26, 2013 05:31 PM)
- Then why did they elect him? Who cares about Vietnam? Everybody criticized us for that one. He was not treated as a wildman, and you know it. He was treated like a European Gandhi, another fool. I'm glad he's dead. Vietnam wasn't the only thing he criticized us for. Were all the European countries perfect?
- The Swiss were small, weak, and surrounded. What was the Swede's excuse?
- Sweden is having major problems with its Turkish immigrants which are well-documented. Apparently they don't like them entering the Swedish mainstream and dating their blondes. My problem is with their hypocrisy. Their criticism was not justified because a) It was none of their business, b) we were working to improve things, and c)ultimately, they were no better.
- Sweden isn't as successful as you think. It's having economic problems too. The 18th Century is relevant because it shows Sweden was warlike until it got a major beat-down. Then they decided not to fight, but to sell to everyone who did.
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michael_wallace_ellwood — 12 years ago(August 25, 2013 10:21 AM)
Do you mean Olof Palme?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Olof_Palme
Looks like your knowledge of Swedish history is about as accurate as your knowledge of Swedish cuisine? -
pmiano100 — 12 years ago(August 26, 2013 05:22 PM)
Okay, so I gooofed up on a name. My bad. But the fact remains that Sweden was a warlike country until it got its butt kicked, like many others. That's what is relevant. Also, Sweden's history of selling to both sides during wars while staying "neutral" is well documented. It's central policy is to make nice to the apparent winner and assume America will always forgive, which it always does. As for cuisine, don't get smart with me. You'd probably go into a restaurant in Shanghai and order chop suey.