Would YOU sacrifice New York City …?
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graham-167 — 14 years ago(December 18, 2011 07:30 AM)
Um, this is just stupid. For one, the answer would be a simple "no".
For another, it would have meant the end of the US as an influential power in the world. What country would ever have allied itself with the US again, knowing that the US would simply screw them over at any opportunity? In the superpower age the very least that would have happened would be the entire world aligning itself with the Russians.
Not to mention that both France and the UK had nuclear weapons of their own, both tactical and strategic. If they saw Russia rolling towards them, that could easily have provoked World War III. No more US anyway.
There really was nothing else to be done but what happened. -
seanspotatobusiness — 12 years ago(December 20, 2013 02:21 PM)
That doesn't work; the offer had to be something
immediate
, not a promise of what you will do over the next couple of months. Again, it was relevant that the Russian ambassador to the US was in New York. -
jgroub — 10 years ago(January 22, 2016 02:34 PM)
Not quite; the Russian ambassador to the UN was in NYC. The Russian ambassador to the US is in Washington. But Washington isn't as big of a target as NYC is.
I want the doctor to take your picture so I can look at you from inside as well. -
Poizen_Prince — 15 years ago(August 13, 2010 05:28 PM)
If I were the President I would maybe offer Berlin and Western Europe as compensation to the Soviets, no way would I ever order the deliberate killing of American lives.
And that is why America, for all its power, is fundamentally weak.
I doubt a single real American president in history
would
have the courage to commit such an unthinkable act so as to prevent all-out war.
Despite people's insistence that there had to be another way of dealing with the destruction of Moscow (financial remuneration, etc.) the sad fact of the matter is that the Russians are just as petty & blood-thirsty in culture as you Americans.
They would want an eye for an eye. Even offering them all of Western Europe (which America would have no right to do & would simply lead to a situation where - with no other option available - the rest of Europe would ally itself with Russia & assimilate into the Soviet Union, rather than be overrun; pitting the majority of Eurasia & much of the rest of the world against America) would not be enough to quench their blood-lust. Five million Russians died, they would want five million American lives in return.
At this point I offer this quote from the American author "Mark Twain":
The pitifulest thing out is a mob; that's what an army isa mob; they don't fight with courage that's born in them, but with courage that's borrowed from their mass, and from their officers. But a mob without any man at the head of it, is beneath pitifulness.Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
And that is exactly what America is. A mob chanting the mantra of "We are America", over & over again.
American lives are not special, they are not unique, they are not more valuable than any other human life.
It is the inability of the American mind-set to comprehend this fact, and to appreciate the reality of the no-win scenario (requiring a simple cutting of losses, if possible), that makes America so weak.
Even after the horrific atrocities of "9/11", as you insist on calling it, America always swings back around to the fundamental belief that you're basically indestructible, that you were created by God with a "Manifest Destiny" to dominate the rest of the world, and that - viewing, as you seem to, life on Earth as a competition for said dominance - you will "win" the battle one day.
A full-scale nuclear exchange would destroy
all
humanity, America included - but no American president would have the courage or humility to do what
had
to be done to prevent it.
The fact that you would happily sacrifice
hundreds
of millions of "foreigners" (allies, at that) to save a few million of your fellow countrymen just exemplifies America's pathetically cowardly & selfish outlook.
Of course, not
all
Americans think this way - but the vast majority seem to, and a chain is only as strong as its weakest link.
To hate another simply for proving you to be in the wrong is the lowest form of cowardice -
liscarkat-2 — 14 years ago(April 25, 2011 03:08 PM)
Dear Poizen Prince,
Just as we did in the past (twice), the next time your morally righteous, intellectually superior little country is in danger of being plowed under, we weak, cowardly Americans will come on over and save your magnificent asses from destruction, at the price of thousands of our own lives, so you can go on living free and calling us names. Then we'll give you billions of dollars of our hard-earned tax money so you can rebuild (we'll do the same for those who attacked you). We are so selfish! -
eab-8 — 10 years ago(January 30, 2016 01:10 PM)
The movie was released more than 50 years ago. Everyone knows the "surprise" ending by now. The President's Solomonic solution is now part of American cultural and political folklore. I wouldn't worry about spoilers here.
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rohonnag — 16 years ago(July 01, 2009 12:37 PM)
which is absurd!!
this is like that episode in star trek where computers fight the battles and people simply voluntarily walk into disintegration chambers!!!
i mean in the normal course of events USA would be very sorry, would get the NATO to step in to avoid complete war, pay a lot of money to soviet, help them in every way possible, bend over backswards in poilitical meetings and USA and russia end up as allies (like usa and japan)
but in the world of fiction, the president like a mad man (and a traitor) attcks his own country and commits mass murder,
also no president has that power it has to go through a lot of channels and such a mad-power crazy absurd thing can never take place
"Everybody knows you never go full retard"- Kirk Lazarus
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Locomotiva1 — 16 years ago(July 09, 2009 11:36 AM)
yes, it's interesting that, in both Fail-safe and Dr.Strangelove, it's just a Yankee-vs-Rooskie problem.
I may think about a call to NATO headquarters and the Allies to say "Now then, boys, you know how we've always talked about the possibility of something going wrong with the Bomb.
Well, he have. Don't worry if the reds are a bit nervous. Sat tight and watch your fire.
We'll fix it nuking the Empire States Building within minutes" -
tad-32 — 16 years ago(August 08, 2009 05:47 PM)
The Soviet premier did not give the President the option.
Also, why don't you try to think of this objectively
You think America would be satisfied if the Russians accidentally leveled NYC themselves and offered an apology and monetary compensation?
No.
You think we would have been satisfied after 9/11 if BinLaden sent a taped message to CNN and Aljazera that it was a mistake and that he was willing to give 10 million to each family that had lost a loved one?
No -
ripperneedler — 16 years ago(August 09, 2009 12:51 PM)
You think America would be satisfied if the Russians accidentally leveled NYC themselves and offered an apology and monetary compensation?
No.
America? All of America? America the people? America the polticians? America the Generals?
After 8 million dead, dying and wounded casualtieswhat would I be satisfied with? Hmmmmm
An equal number of dead Russians? Would that be running through my head as something 'satisfying'?
Or would I be burying my dead and busy dealing with the all the after affects?
Would I be thanking God I was still alive?
Would I be asking why my Air Force that defends my nation couldn't bring down 6 bombers, even after being given several hours notice, target destination, and tons of helpful hints honestly given by the Soviet Air Force on just how to do it?
Would I be hating all things nuclear?
You think we would have been satisfied after 9/11 if BinLaden sent a taped message to CNN and Aljazera that it was a mistake and that he was willing to give 10 million to each family that had lost a loved one?
No
Ummmactually, Yes. Not totally satisfied, but If he came through with the dollars it would be a start, but obviously there would still have to be a bit more that would be needed from himobviously. Stillconceptually, I would accept the offer as an opening. Would I slam two planes into two Afghani or Saudi Arabian towers if he reneged? Probably not.
Get yer cursor off my spoilers
! -
seanspotatobusiness — 12 years ago(December 20, 2013 02:29 PM)
It was not about justice; it was about making the Chairman certain that the President was sincere in his assertion that this was a mistake, rather than part of a deliberate attack. You should watch the movie again.
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Ulex — 15 years ago(August 22, 2010 08:29 PM)
If I was president, no way I would be able to bomb New York, or D.C. for that matter. Maybe Indianapolis or some place .. but I'd likely just sit their and wait for the apocalypse.
I'm pretty sure that if this really played out, that's what would happen. There would have been a lot of confusion and yelling, and then a lot of people saying "There's no way that the Russians would do that," and then boom boom boom.
I think the point of the movie is to say, "This would be the only way out of the situation. As crazy as it is, can you think of a better option?"
I don't think that any amount of negotiation would ever work. Yes, you could give up West Berlin. Hell, throw in France in the deal. The Russian Premier's response would be, "That's awful nice of you, but what with our entire government destroyed, with no way to provide food or money to our citizens, we've got slightly bigger problems on our hands."
It's like negotiating over the price of someone to kill you. How much money would you ever accept?