Apologies if this has been addressed elsewhere, but there's too much to wade through.
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joey_pesci — 13 years ago(March 09, 2013 01:39 PM)
I think killing them always seemed like an odd idea cause surely the lose of the astronauts in a "space accident" would be just as much an excuse to cancel the space program as them not really being able to make it to Mars.
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djsnafu23 — 10 years ago(August 04, 2015 11:00 AM)
That's my main gripe with the movie too- this makes no sense to me.
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Coz lifes too short to listen to Madlib -
subcarrier — 12 years ago(May 27, 2013 10:16 AM)
I honestly think they were killed when they were found. They could never be seen again or the whole cover-up is blown.
The heat shield failure was definately not planned. The astronauts were being taken to the splashdown point when the capsule was lost and the jet was turned around. The G men were waiting to see if the astronauts were really dead before killing them- which is when they got wise and escaped.
And you wanna know the worst part? You're from outta state! -
RosieT20 — 12 years ago(November 16, 2013 02:39 AM)
I think they were killed when they were found too. I didn't want to believe it, but all the evidence does point to it.
However, it was - imo - a plot flaw. It would have been sheer stupidity to kill two whilst one was free to tell the tale. -
SuperCatMonkey — 12 years ago(November 23, 2013 07:20 AM)
Hmmmm It's a very good point. I don't know if I'd go so far as to call it a plot hole in the movie; it has more to do with the bad guys' strategy. It's one thing to get caught faking the Mars mission. It's another to get caught killing people to cover it up - which they had already done (the communications guy from MC). Maybe at that point it didn't matter any more. They had to get rid of them anyway.
The other thing to consider is that if this were intentional, it happened above Hal Holbrook's head. He was genuinely surprised when the heat shield separated. It was clear at that point that they all had to die. If it were left up to him, the astronauts could have talked him out of it and just gone public with the whole thing. It wasn't up to him any longer, though.
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spookyrat1 — 12 years ago(December 13, 2013 04:34 AM)
As one of the earlier posters notes the taglines give the answer anyway.
But it's clear in Kelloway's face and body language that the recaptured astronauts were terminated, as was the disappearing Dr Whittier. Loose ends would be creating more liabilities, than they already had. -
meddle2010 — 12 years ago(October 01, 2013 04:08 PM)
Right. Because this movie is inspired in the "conspiracy theory of the fake moon landing". So: Were the astronauts from the missions Apolo XI to XVII killed after they return to the Earth alive? The answer is No. But the theory says astronauts (as well as other people involved in the fake mission) are forced to keep silence. Therefore the failure of the instruments indicated that the mission ended before return safely to Earth, so the only 3 people that couldn't be seen ever were the astronauts, and that's the reason that the NASA men needed to kill them.
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SuperCatMonkey — 12 years ago(November 15, 2013 07:20 PM)
I don't see the point of holding onto them. I've never considered that they survived long after being captured.
As far as the heat shield separation goes, I've never seen any reason to believe either way. The first time I saw it I assumed it was a glitch of some kind, but later considered it may have been planned. I don't know of any reason to rule out either story.
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walkerus — 12 years ago(December 14, 2013 06:35 PM)
After viewing this movie several times (last evening being the latest) I think that they would be holding the two captured 'would be astronauts' until the third was captured, then they would be killed.
Why would they be killed in cold blood if Brubaker may suddenly turn up (as he indeed did), then not only would the future plans for space expenditure be thrown out (which is what forced this charade in the first place) but all the top people would be up for murder and many would be spending many years in prison.
The murder of the friend of Elliot Gould, who worked out the scam on his own and then disappeared, could probably not be proven.
I also think that the heat-shield failure was not expected and because of that the charade could no longer be played-out and the three had to be eliminated. After all, the actual mission had been successful (in the eyes of the world) and old-glory had been unfurled on Mars, and the President had given in his blessing.
I find this movie has a top conspiracy plot that will not date in time. -
walkerus — 12 years ago(December 14, 2013 06:40 PM)
After viewing this movie several times (last evening being the latest) I think that they would be holding the two captured 'would be astronauts' until the third was captured, then they would be killed.
Why would they be killed in cold blood if Brubaker may suddenly turn up (as he indeed did), then not only would the future plans for space expenditure be thrown out (which is what forced this charade in the first place) but all the top people would be up for murder and many would be spending many years in prison.
The murder of the friend of Elliot Gould, who worked out the scam on his own and then disappeared, could probably not be proven.
I also think that the heat-shield failure was not expected and because of that the charade could no longer be played-out and the three had to be eliminated. After all, the actual mission had been successful (in the eyes of the world) and old-glory had been unfurled on Mars, and the President had given in his blessing.
I find this movie has a top conspiracy plot that will not date in time. -
RosieT20 — 12 years ago(December 15, 2013 01:47 AM)
I totally agree with your first sentence, and made the same point myself. I just wish the film had taken that route, if only for the sake of logic! Because they didn't show the other two astronauts, I fear they were killed, and that wouldn't have happened until they had all three. Unless they were all mindless and illogical villains!
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L0GAN5 — 11 years ago(June 21, 2014 08:45 AM)
Both interpretations are valid. It was the 70s; the decade of ambiguity. The ominous tone suggests that the astronauts were killed, but if they were killed immediately the film could just have easily shown that. The reason they don't show them being taken away or killed is to purposefully leave the astronauts' fates "open".
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davidmrenton — 11 years ago(August 07, 2014 07:23 AM)
something to point out, when they escape , to the Jet aircraft, the guy standing by the plane doesn't seem suspicious or wary that the three Astronaut's are there without guard. at that point there is no reason to kill them as the constant threat hang's over their families safety in case they feel the need to talk.
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davidemistero — 11 years ago(February 24, 2015 02:36 PM)
Sorry for my eng
i dunno the first, i've always thought that tey were killed on sight but i've read a lots of theores so i dunno but
For the second question you forgot that they were taking the astronauts on the island so i don't think the shield stuff was already riggedand then that evil guy looked really surprised so i don't think was already decided. Maybe as you said, if everything would have been ok they would have used the treathing to family to keep their mouths closed -
puirt-a-beul — 10 years ago(August 15, 2015 09:41 PM)
Well, I think the first two were killed on sight.
Nuke the site from orbit only way to be sure.
And I think the deaths were always part of the plan. At the outset, the plotters threatened to kill the three families or at least bluffed that they would either way, as soon as they did that, there was no going back. Imagine if they went through with their fakery, and brought the three astronauts back alive, and then one or more of the men decided to trade his career and reputation for the need to tell the truth? There would have been a massive public meltdown. The plotters simply couldn't take that chance, if only in the interests of self-preservation.
So they had to fake the landing and the
nearly
-getting-home, to make the program look like a
near
-success and justify further funding. But killing the three astronauts was the only way to guarantee that the word would never get out about the plot. (No doubt the few involved in the actual photography were quietly
disappeared
as well.) So I think the heat-shield failure was always planned; it was a credible way to contain the chance of exposure without bringing the mission into technical disrepute. The plotters' one big mistake (without which the movie wouldn't have had a Third Act,
natch
) was in not killing the astronauts immediately, once the heat-shield had "failed".
As for the fugitive astronauts, the safest, most reliable course of action was to kill each one separately, as soon as he was found. And presumably, hide them in the desert and leave predators to dispose of the remains. Take their suits, probably, and any identifying personal effects; maybe cut off their hands and heads. Far less risky than carting bodies with them, whether alive or dead, and completely deniable should anything go wrong.
tl;dr :
Kill tham! Kill them all!!!
You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment. -
hornacek — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 07:05 AM)
I'm pretty sure they were trying to kill the astronauts once they fled the hangar. The helicopters were shooting at Brolin once he got in the plane. Besides, what would be the point of capturing them and keeping them alive? Every second they're alive threatens to expose the conspiracy. They had to die.
I assumed the heat shield failure was a surprise to Hollbrook, he seemed genuinely shocked when it happened and the astronauts "died" upon re-entry. I think the plan legitimately was to put the astronauts in the pod once it landed and make sure they knew that if they ever talked they and their families would be killed. -
RosieT20 — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 12:18 PM)
I still maintain that killing any of them before they had them all would have been madness. If only one escaped, that would be enough to get them the death sentence - you'd surely not risk murder until there was no-one to testify against you?
Did the writers intend us to think the NASA men were incompetent? I don't think so - I think it was a plot weakness, and there should have been some clarification about what happened to the other two astronauts. -
hornacek — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 02:37 PM)
They had already escaped once - every moment they were alive was another chance for them to escape again. They had to be killed immediately. And the conspirators have already tried to kill them, I don't think they're worried about going from attempted murder to murder if they get caught. They think they won't get caught. All they have to do is catch these three and kill them.