The I hate Emily thread
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mabostic — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 04:05 PM)
Don't get me wrong, I hate Emily. She's awful. And I always hated her for saying Ross couldn't see Rachel any longer.
HOWEVER- As I got older, I kind of understood it. He was basically best friends with his on and off again ex-girlfriend, who he sees everyday, who still has feelings for him, whose name he says in place of hers at their wedding, and even after that, knowing how upsetting and embarrassing it was for her at her wedding for him to do that, she finds him at the airport about to go on his honeymoon trip with the same woman whose name he said.
Then years later, they have a baby and eventually get back together.
So, I guess I can understand her reasoning for not wanting him to see her. But, she's still a bitch. -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 08:53 PM)
mabostic
wrote:
I hate Emily. She's awful.
I don't. I like Emily and I think Ross would've been much better off with her than with Rachel.
And I always hated her for saying Ross couldn't see Rachel any longer.
If she is going to move to New York, she wants her marriage to have a chance, and it simply isn't going to have a chance if Ross is still seeing Rachel.
Ross is never going to get over Rachel if he is still seeing her. And Emily is going to be a nervous wreck if Ross is still seeing Rachel waiting for something to happen. Their marriage would not survive under those circumstances.
Emily also needs to know if Ross is serious before she moves 3000 miles. It turns out that he wasn't serious about her. He did not really want to get over Rachel. He preferred to be miserable hoping for Rachel than married to Emily.
He was basically best friends with his on and off again ex-girlfriend,
That is really not an accurate description of the situation.
Ross was always compulsively in love with Rachel. He always preferred Rachel to any other woman in the world IF she was available.
He dumped Bonnie in a second when Rachel crooked her little finger.
But Rachel seems to not be available, and he tries to get over her by marrying Emily. That is the way that people typically get over the sort of mental state that Ross is in.
But Rachel, as she does for seven years, gives Ross hope that maybe this time she is available. At the very last minute, at the point of no return, when it's all set for Emily to move to New York, Ross realizes he wants to be able to see Rachel more than he wants to be married to Emily. And so he provokes an argument with her by taking what she said about wanting to know where he is all the time literally, and he bailed on their arrangement.
They were not on-again off-again. They were on and then they were off for seven years. Rachel could've gotten back with Ross at essentially any point if she had wanted to, but instead, she keeps Ross on her hook by leaving him a little hope.
Do you recognize that Rachel only wants Ross when he is not available because he is with another woman, but as soon as Ross has dumped the other woman and is available, Rachel doesn't want him anymore?
who he sees everyday, who still has feelings for him,
It is difficult to know what Rachel's feelings are she could get back with Ross anytime she wanted to but Ross is compulsively in love with Rachel. There's no question about that.
whose name he says in place of hers at their wedding,
A classic Freudian slip. Rachel doesn't actually say that she loves Ross, but part of Ross's mind guessed that that was why she showed up unexpected, at the last minute.
You do not say the name of a woman who is just your "best friend" at the altar when you are getting married to someone else.
and even after that, knowing how upsetting and embarrassing it was for her at her wedding for him to do that, she finds him at the airport about to go on his honeymoon trip with the same woman whose name he said.
Doesn't that say something to you about Ross's state of mind? He is very easily persuaded not only to leave his wife behind, but to take his ex-girlfriend along.
So, I guess I can understand her reasoning for not wanting him to see her.
Well, if you fell in love with a man and married him and learned at the altar that he has another woman stuck in his head, and the next day that is confirmed rather dramatically, would you not want your husband to stay away from that woman?
I know that many woman would not want to stay married to him, but if you did, wouldn't you want your husband nowhere near her?
The thing is this. If Ross really wants to get over Rachel, and he stays away from her, and he builds a life with Emily, he will get over her.
Ross persuades Emily that he wants to get over Rachel, but he was lying both to himself and to her.
This might make more sense to you if you have ever had a man stuck in your head that you didn't want there. By that I mean someone that you are in love with, but you know that it won't work out for any number of reasons. Including that they don't want you.
And you don't want to be in love with that man.
You can't just snap your fingers and will the man out of your mind. What does work is getting involved with someone else and building a relationship with them. But that is not going to work if you are still seeing the person who's stuck in your head all the time. -
Painbow — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 04:14 PM)
Emily was fine.
She had good reasons to be upset.
And I think she knew full-well that Ross never seeing Rachel again was extremely unlikely; she was just testing him. She wanted to know that he was willing to put her first and willing to remove Rachel from his life until their marriage settled in.
But she knew it couldn't be permanent that was never gonna happen. -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 09:03 PM)
xMartyMcFlyx
wrote:
First of all, she tells Ross he isn't allowed to even be friends with Rachel.
Because Ross is still in love with Rachel, and he is not going to get over that if he continues to see her.
Ross has to make a choice between being married to Emily and seeing Rachel. Ultimately, he chooses seeing Rachel. Emily was clearly right about not wanting Ross to see Rachel.
She needs to know where he is "all the time"
She did not mean it literally. Ross took it literally as an excuse to bail on his agreement with her.
She just came out of nowhere into their lives.
I have no idea why you hold that against her.
She was obnoxious from the get go.
She was such a pleasure compared to Rachel. She's a much nicer person than Rachel. She really cares about Ross. Rachel prick teased Ross for seven years. She never gets back with Ross until the end, but she never lets Ross go and get on with his life. -
herbsuperb — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 10:41 PM)
Emily was the victim in the whole thing. Ross treated her terribly. He courted, proposed to, and married the poor girl while he was still pining for another woman. Somebody should have kicked Ross's arse. Emily was a perfectly lovely person up until the point Ross cheated on her (sort of). He was unfaithful in spirit, and that's not right. Emily is a hero. Go Emily! She deserves a proper gentleman. Not dumb old cheatin' Ross.
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ppllkk — 9 years ago(October 08, 2016 08:31 PM)
trowbridge_nancy
wrote:
And she deserved better than being ross second choice
She deserved a lot better. And she really doesn't deserve having posters here dump on her because she insisted on the conditions that would give her marriage the best chance to work.
there is no doubt that if Rachel had told Ross at that time that she still loved him & wanted him back he would have dumped Emily.
Rachel could've gotten back with Ross any time that she wanted to. Later in the series, she would've had to convince Ross that she was serious because he had been burned so many times, but she could've gotten back with him without that much trouble.
Of course Rachel doesn't want to get back with Ross.
I'm always surprised at how many people don't understand that Ross always wants Rachel. Sometimes he thinks he's gotten over her, but he hasn't. Sometimes he thinks he doesn't want her, but it isn't true, and he recognizes that fairly quickly.
And they don't understand that Rachel could get back with Ross very easily. -
LiteraryLadyofLothlorien — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 02:19 AM)
I really liked Emily, she was very suited to Ross and completely ambushed. I cannot watch the wedding episode as I just feel so angry for her!
How was she obnoxious? She was kind and straightforward.
To you, Baldrick, the Renaissance was just something that happened to other people, wasn't it? -
LiteraryLadyofLothlorien — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 03:06 AM)
Might it be because she is English with a good accent? I often get accused of being a snob simply for my accent!
To you, Baldrick, the Renaissance was just something that happened to other people, wasn't it? -
ImReallyANarc — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 07:20 AM)
You guys do all make valid points and maybe I'm being a bit too harsh.
I just never liked her, she just comes off as a snobby bitch to me.
Nah, I think it's easy to see why many people dislike her. She's sort of like Skyler White on Breaking Bad: she was trying to save her marriage while her husband was making very destructive decisions. She wasn't necessarily bad but her actions weren't in line with the characters we've been rooting for.
As for Skyler, I think the hate during Season 2 was unwarranted. Season 3, though, she was just awful. -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 08:50 AM)
ImReallyANarc
wrote:
She wasn't necessarily bad but her actions weren't in line with the characters we've been rooting for.
Do you mean that if Emily moves to New York, and Ross stays away from Rachel, it will disrupt the group?
I can't see that as a reason to dislike Emily. Rachel's shenanigans created the situation in which Emily realizes that she has to keep Ross away from Rachel for her marriage to have a chance. She did not know that before London.
One difference in perspective that we may have is that from the RR breakup on, I was rooting for Ross to get angry enough at Rachel that he would not go anywhere near her on his own, and I don't understand why he didn't. I was rooting for Ross to get Rachel out of his head for good and marry some kindhearted girl.
But he remained obsessed by
PSYCHO BITCH
. -
ImReallyANarc — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 10:21 AM)
It would disrupt the group and, even if you don't like Rachel, Ross did. And even if he wasn't trying to form a relationship with her at the time he still wanted her friendship. That's what I mean by "rooting for" the same characters.
All he wanted was his best friend
and
wife; because he couldn't have both, most viewers blamed Emily even though Rachel's actions were the impetus in dissolving Ross' marriage. -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 11:02 AM)
ImReallyANarc
wrote:
because he couldn't have both, most viewers blamed Emily even though Rachel's actions were the impetus in dissolving Ross' marriage.
I agree with that. I just think it is grossly unfair to Emily and that annoys me.
All he wanted was his best friend and wife;
I would put that differently. I think that Ross wants a periodic fix of seeing the woman that he is compulsively in love with. I don't think "friendship" describes situation.
After writing this below, it occurs to me that I may be more arguing with other people that I am with you, but it is already written, so here it is.
even if you don't like Rachel, Ross did.
Ross is compulsively in love with a woman who doesn't want him but periodically gives him hope that maybe someday she will. I believe that Ross would be a lot better off with any number of other women.
His attraction to Rachel is not a rational matter and verges on the pathological as it continues over the years. It is a classic case of someone being in love with the wrong person and not being able to get over it.
And even if he wasn't trying to form a relationship with her at the time
Ross would always try to form a relationship with Rachel if there was some hint that she was available.
While the thing with Emily was going on, Rachel told Ross that she loved him. She took it back immediately, but she said it, and Ross heard it, and it has to have stuck in the back of his mind. I believe it was a major factor when Ross finally chose seeing Rachel over marriage to Emily.
he still wanted her friendship.
When you are obsessively in love with someone, you cannot just be friends with them at least while a large part of your mind still desperately wants them. The emotions are too strong. Ross may have thought that he could be married to Emily and friends with Rachel, but it doesn't work that way when you have a person stuck in your head.
Rachel was not "just a friend" for Ross, and there was no way that she could be in the foreseeable future. Maybe if she got married, and she was completely unavailable, but Rachel never had a serious relationship other than Ross in the series.
There is no way that Emily could have any confidence that Rachel was "just a friend." Ross demonstrated in London that Rachel was not "just a friend."
I think it is extremely unlikely that Rachel would have stayed out of the marriage if she was still seeing Ross. But even if she did, Emily would still see her as just waiting for her chance, and if her chance came, I am sure she would take it.
Ross understood about this situation earlier. Mark is clearly after Rachel, and it makes Ross very nervous that she is spending so much time around a man who is just waiting for his chance. He thought that he had it when he called Rachel's apartment, and she was upset. He went over even after being asked not to. He did not succeed but it was worth a try.
Here Ross is oblivious to Emily feeling the same way that he felt.
No one wants the person that they love to be spending a lot of time around someone who is after them. It isn't a matter of trust. It is a matter that sometimes things go wrong and having someone there waiting to pounce is not a good idea.
The bottom line is that Ross simply has to make a choice between Rachel and Emily. He can't have both. And he chooses Rachel and another five years of being led on by her.
When you get married, you are supposed to choose your wife over your friends. That does not happen here.
I probably should make this explicit. Rachel does not want to get back with Ross until the very end of the series. I believe she does not want to be seriously involved with anyone until she is ready to settle down. But she also does not want Ross to be unavailable if she decides that she wants him because he is married to someone else.
Thus she interferes with Ross's relationships but does not get back with him herself. That makes sense out of what happens. I don't know anything else that does other than Rachel being insane and vicious. -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 12:03 PM)
Let me add this.
ImReallyANarc
wrote:
most viewers blamed Emily even though Rachel's actions were the impetus in dissolving Ross' marriage.
It was Rachel's shenanigans that created the situation in which Emily did not want Ross around Rachel.
But what really did in the marriage is that Ross really didn't want to get over Rachel. Ross spent all of this time convincing Emily with great sincerity that she is the one that he wants, but it wasn't true, and he recognized that at the very last moment.
There are times that I think that he deserves Rachel. -
ImReallyANarc — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 12:27 PM)
Oh most definitely. While I would say that Ross and Emily would have lasted much longer had Rachel
not
gone to London, the marriage was doomed to fail. Ross wasn't ready.
Anyway though I don't think I dislike Rachel as much as you do, I think you and I are mostly in agreement here! -
ppllkk — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 12:48 PM)
ImReallyANarc
wrote:
I think you and I are mostly in agreement here!
I think we are. I am not that used to having people be in any sort of agreement with me.
the marriage was doomed to fail. Ross wasn't ready.
There we don't agree. Ross tells us in the pilot that he wants to be married that was right before Rachel appeared in a wedding dress having decided that she did not want to be married.
I think Ross wants very badly to be married. He wants to settle down. He wants a family. And he's a very flexible person who will make compromises to make a relationship work.
The best thing would've been if he had been willing to move to England. Then Rachel is completely out of the picture, and she will fade in his mind as she did after high school.
Following a suggestion by Tigerlily, I believe the major factor in his not being willing to move was not Ben, but that he wasn't willing to give up seeing Rachel. But even living in New York, I believe that it would've worked if Ross really wanted it to work, and he stayed away from Rachel. Emily clearly wants it to work.
P. S. Ross was married to Carol for seven years. He wanted the relationship to continue and only didn't because of something that was not even remotely Ross's fault.
I find it hard to say that Ross isn't ready for marriage to a normal, goodhearted woman. Emily is a normal goodhearted woman. Rachel isn't. -
mrssutherland2013 — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 01:30 PM)
HOW on EARTH anyone can berate Emily for any of her actions, while forgiving Rachel's is absolutely beyond me.
People love to forget that Emily acted the way she did
because
of Rachel. Rachel was a nasty cow regarding her from the beginning, starting with the insane jealousy the Ross was in a "hotel in vermont".
Cue-how did this HAPPEN!!! I really feel like screaming at her-because YOU made Ross take her out so that YOU could spend the evening with YOUR love interest you selfish biatch lol
I don't blame Emily for any of her actions. Sure, to tell Ross she wants to know whee he is ALL THE TIME is a bit extreme, but, really can you blame her AT ALL?? Emily had no issue with Rachel before the wedding. And even after the wedding, she saw Rachel and Ross about to board a plane to HER honeymoon. (which I still think is the most stupid ridiculous decision either of them made btw)
And
Emily
is the one with the problem??!! Really??!!
cArNiVaLs oF fAyGo