Why do Christian dwell on this chapter of Jesus' story .
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bastasch8647 — 9 years ago(December 28, 2016 10:59 AM)
What kind of God would ask someone to submit to this kind torment anyway ?
The sacrifice was voluntary. Jesus offered himself freely without human or divine coercion, the idea being that only a sinless sacrifice would be truly efficacious, and Jesus, being both "the perfect man" and "God the Son", uniquely fulfilled this requirement. -
marty-130-840283 — 9 years ago(January 16, 2017 06:56 PM)
we owe him out allegiance?
Awrobel, no we dont owe him allegiance.
Its a choice.- Align with Jesus (believe he was God, trust him as payment for your sins)
or - Dont align with Jesus (no thanks, I dont believe in God etc)
The choice is yours.
God is merely offering you a choice.
Its up to you.
- Align with Jesus (believe he was God, trust him as payment for your sins)
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awrobel — 9 years ago(January 16, 2017 07:49 PM)
Touchy subject, I admit, just asking out my own ignorance and personal edification. I'm not being.judgmental, and as non-christian,
but one who respects all faiths I find this subject fascinating. To be frank as child I found the image of the crucifxion unsettling and I never understood it central role in the faith. -
marty-130-840283 — 9 years ago(January 16, 2017 09:31 PM)
To be frank as child I found the image of the crucifxion unsettling and I never understood it central role in the faith.
Hi awrobel, no problem.
Does the following, help you to understand the crucifixions central role? if not, ask more questions:- God created Adam and Eve good
- Satan tempted Adam and Eve, and they disobeyed God
- After their disobedience, Sin entered the world (death, sickness, disease etc)
- Humanity (all descendants of Adam and Eve) inherited their Sin nature
- all human beings therefore have a Sin nature (in a sense, we cant help it, we are born cursed)
- Because Sin is an affront to God, Sin requires the penalty of death (you and me deserve hell, because of our sin nature)
- Jesus (Gods son) came to earth to live as a man, and offer himself as a sacrifice (death) in our place
- Jesus was crucified, and took the penalty of death, on our behalf, so that we would not have to
- God poured out all his wrath on Sin, on Jesus (who was perfect and sinless)when he was on the cross
- Jesus died, then was ressurected and ascended to Heaven, taking the death penalty on himself, on our behalf
- therefore, if you "believe" in Jesus, trust that his death was for you, on your behalf, you are freed from the penalty of death (Jesus took the penalty for you)
When you truly believe in your heart, and ask for forgiveness, admit that you are a sinner, admit that you deserve death, and thank Jesus for dieing for you, in your place, you are reconciled back to a relationship with God, and gauranteed entrance into Heaven the moment you believe. Your salvation is eternally secure, once you believe truly from your heart
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Rumble_McSkirmish — 9 years ago(December 28, 2016 12:34 AM)
Because it's like an ego orgasm
"Look how awesome my savior is and how much he suffered. No one has ever suffered more!" Ignores pretty much all history
That's about it. Just something to jerk the ego's wang to till you're satisfied
Panzer vor! -
FirstBlood1982 — 9 years ago(January 16, 2017 08:17 PM)
Without Christ fulfilling this purpose, there would be no salvation for any of humanity. It was the single most important thing He came here to do, as He told us Himself. As beautiful as His teachings are, taking the punishment for the sins of humanity upon Himself and resurrecting to conquer death itself is much more important than any amount of inspirational speeches could ever be.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews+9%3A12&version=NLT
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+14%3A6&version=NLT
+++by His wounds we are healed. - Isaiah 53:5+++ -
bastasch8647 — 9 years ago(January 16, 2017 11:19 PM)
Without Christ fulfilling this purpose, there would be no salvation for any of humanity.
That is a doctrine not found in, and utterly foreign to, the Hebrew Bible, which clearly states that Yahweh instituted an eternal covenant - one form for Jews, and the Noahide covenant for Gentiles. Yahweh, in his mercy, was said to have designed these covenants for the salvation of all humankind, both Jew and Gentile. No sacrifice of "the perfect God-Man" was anticipated or prophesied in the Hebrew Bible. No such sacrifice was wanted or desired either by Yahweh or his Jewish and Gentile children. That idea came after John and Paul decided that Covenant and Torah were abolished by (the wholly fictional) "atoning sacrifice on the cross" that Jesus purportedly made. The Gospels themselves, where they have not been contaminated with Johannine and Pauline soteriology, attest to the enduring character of Yahweh's original covenants with Jews and Gentiles. In fact, Luke's Gospel, although it, like the other Gospels, contains a narrative of Jesus' Passion and death, never once references the atoning sacrifice doctrine. For Luke, Jesus' martyric death was at most a ransom for many, but not a ransom from "original sin" or the death of a World-Savior.
Moreover - and again - Luke in Acts reveals that for the Judean/Jerusalem disciples, Torah, Temple, Law, and kosher were still in effect for Jews and Jewish converts to the Jesus sect, long after Jesus' death:
19 Paul greeted them and recounted one by one the things God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. 20 When they heard this, they glorified God. Then they said to Paul, You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of them are zealous for the Law. 21 But they are under the impression that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or observe our customs.
Acts 21:19-21 - bible hub
Thus even the NT testifies to an old tradition that Jesus' death was not an atoning sacrifice that abolished the Law, the customs, and the Covenants. It witnesses to the fact that Jesus' death was not atoning, did not replace Torah, Law, Covenant, and customsjust as it witnesses to the treacherous Pauline doctrine that Judaism had been invalidated by Jesus' fictional "sacrifice" on the cross. -
Navaros — 9 years ago(February 01, 2017 10:16 AM)
Wouldn't it be more beneficial to speak of his teachings alone ?
Jesus' teachings are important too, but no, speaking of them alone are not more beneficial.
Acceptance of Jesus' shed blood for one's sin debt is the only way to become cleansed before God and therefore allowed entry into Heaven. By the same token, acceptance of Jesus' blood is also the only way to avoid entrance into Hell. That's why it is essential.
Oh, and anything the posters like batasch or mamu or rumble or uther say is wrong. They pretend to know about the Bible, but in reality they are disbelievers of the Bible who actually know nothing about it and fabricate their own meanings for it that have no relation to what is actually says and means.
"Science creates fictions to explain facts" Gilman