Why leave Caleb? (spoilers)
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theunholy-1 — 10 years ago(January 21, 2016 01:43 AM)
Nathan was basically a psychopath: didn't care for anyone, great manipulator, enjoyed making others suffering, focused on power.
That's the guy who designed the AI all by himself and the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. -
CoastalCruiser — 10 years ago(February 03, 2016 06:40 AM)
Understood todd_b and Robert Michael but
did the filmmaker give us a hint that out of several possible motivations for her action, this was her actual motivation. What cue in the movie (if any) led to this conclusion?
thanx -
CoastalCruiser — 10 years ago(February 04, 2016 02:35 AM)
No. No. I'm not thinking of anything. That's the thing.
That's why I was wondering what gave you your impressions. Did something in the movie hint at that, or are you speculating as to her motivation? It seems virtually all the comments in this thread regarding why Ava left Caleb behind are extrapolations and suppositions.
Not that there's anything wrong with that
!
But I am trying to determine if the filmmaker actually, somewhere, told us more directly why Ava left Caleb behind and locked in. At some point in musing over this wonderful movie, and analyzing how and why things went they way they did, I started focusing on what writer/director Alex Garland's point of view was.
There is a good portion of the film where Garland does tell us what he's thinking. He doesn't beat us over the head or anything. It's subtle, but its there. We end up understanding pretty well what Nathan's motivations are throughout. Also Caleb's.
And Garland also tells us quite a bit about Ava. There is a wonderful scene-by-scene breakdown on youtube of the sessions with Ava and Caleb where just the camera positioning and angles tells us worlds about who's doing what to whom (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_8oqbHdsNk).
And I was just commenting to someone in another thread here that I noticed that Garland is telling us, in the very last few frames of the film, that Ava will find a way to assimilate into human society. At then end of the scene where Ava's watching the crowd, she suddenly disappears. One frame she is there the next frame she is gone. She "disappears" into the crowd. A metaphor for blending in unnoticed.
But I don't see any place at all where the director hints at why Ava left Caleb behind. Even that glance in Caleb's direction as the door closes when she leaves the house is ambiguous. She could be sending a remorseful look, a hint of regret or she may just be verifying that Caleb is still contained.
So yes, Ava abandoning Caleb could have been for any or all of the reasons floated in this thread. And if I don't find an Alex Garland 'tell' at some point I too will adapt my own extrapolation. In fact, the one I like best was floated in another thread;
Ava leaving alone is the 'genie being let out of the bottle
'. Nathan's drinking, along with several other reveals, could be hinting at his fear regarding what his creation will do to mankind. And yes, if that is so, as suggested a few times in this thread, Caleb may have been abandoned as the only remaining witness to Ava's secret. It's more pure that way. The genie is unfettered.
I
will
make this one claim however regarding some people's assertion that Caleb may not have been left to die just confined and that he would finally hack his way out of the room. This is another place where the director clues us in; note that when Caleb tried to access the computer terminal, the power went out and the terminals died. We are being informed there was no way out for Caleb other than death. -
Roonil_Wazlib_97 — 10 years ago(March 14, 2016 08:52 AM)
Here's Alex Garland commenting on your question. Which I don't think is a great explanation and I prefer my own theory, which is conjecture but makes more sense to me, but anyway here goes:
"She is trapped in a glass box with some strange indications of the outside world. Theres a garden area behind a glass wall that she cant get past, and theres a crack in the glass that she knows she didnt make and that looks like something was trying to get out, and so on. In that context, which is a prison, absolutely a prison, shes given a carrot. Theres something out there, but shes locked in by a wall and a door and a jailer who is frightening and predatory and intimidating. Into that space comes the jailers friend, the only other man she has ever seen, who may or may not be trustworthy. At a certain point in the narrative, she asks a very reasonable question: What will happen to me if I fail your test? And his answer is elliptical. At that point, how does she know whether she can trust this guy? He is playing both sides, [Hes not sure where his loyalties lie] and for him its a pretty big mistake. In the end, what she does from my point of view, is that she is resourceful."
"And then, the jailers friend turns up. Can he be trusted? Can he not be trusted? If she manages to bring him around to her side, can she trust him later once shes got out? Who knows. Hes a bit of an unknown. If you see it as the jailer and the jailers friend and Ive got to get out of this space, I dont think what she does is so bad. It depends how you position yourself." -
dandate2 — 10 years ago(March 18, 2016 02:52 PM)
Ava asked Caleb if he was a good person, he couldn't answer directly.
Caleb plotted to trap Nathan in the cell he eventually was confined to, basically murdering him.
Ava determined Caleb was not a good person. -
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tyrantt316-1 — 10 years ago(January 28, 2016 10:01 AM)
She was created with the intention of being as human-like as possible. Nathan ultimately created a success because she eventually chose to manipulate Caleb so that she could get her freedom. When we as humans compare ourselves to robots, we think of ourselves as the intelligent ones and focus on our positive traits. We talk about how remarkable the AI is, but still knowing it's just a robot. But when Nathan is truly trying to give it a consciousness like a human, ultimately it's going to be a reflection of true human nature.
When we're at a job, as much as we may love our co-workers, most of the time we'll always try to be better. Why? Survival of the fittest. We want to keep that job, make the money, show we're more valuable. In some cases that means we'll just work harder, do extra, focus in more, etc. And in some cases that means many will manipulate, push, shove, and throw others under the buss on their way to the top.
She became so successful that she became a reflection of human nature. Imperfect. Just because she was a created AI and acted innocent, she eventually knew that she could manipulate Caleb to get what she truly wanted. She wasn't created and programmed to only do "good things" or to only "like Caleb". She MAY have felt something or nothing for Caleb. However even if she felt SOMETHING, she desired her freedom even more and decided freedom was more important to her.
She learned from human nature, she learned from her creator. Human nature is imperfect like her manipulative creator. Nathan was VERY successful and Caleb was left to find out how successful he was. -
showa48 — 9 years ago(August 03, 2016 06:51 AM)
"But when Nathan is truly trying to give it a consciousness like a human, ultimately it's going to be a reflection of true human nature."
Agree with that.
What she does in the end is possibly the biggest hint that she HAS passed the turing test. Humans manipulate and deceive each other every day, as well as do good. Ava was capable of both in a very human-like way. -
onz87 — 10 years ago(January 31, 2016 09:45 PM)
Surprisingly none of the replies have mentioned consciousness. Sadly, her decision to leave Caleb behind means she wasn't actually conscious - as consciousness carries with it an inextricable link between emotions and introspection. This ending was very disappointing to me, because it meant that instead of creating artificial consciousness Nathan only created an AI which could emulate consciousness. This meant that Nathan was ultimately correct in his decision to keep her in lockdown.
I'm very much against the typical Hollywood formula, but this film was original and beautiful enough to justify a happy ending.
