Cleopatra wasn't black.
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shmn — 19 years ago(October 18, 2006 04:15 AM)
funny becuz the exact opposite (could) be true, namely that she was of arian race, considering that Cleopatra was from the Ptolemaus family, one of the 4 generals who took a forth of the greek empire, made by Alexander The Great (a blonde boy)
nuff said? -
isabellabruno000 — 14 years ago(November 04, 2011 07:21 PM)
Nobody really knows what she looked like.
Upon doing some research on her origins, I'm beginning to visualize her looking rather like your average italian female of today. Dark hair, dark eyes and olive skin.
The Ptolemy dynasty was descended from the Greek Macedonian Ptolemy Soter, established as ruler of Egypt by Alexander the Great's conquest of Egypt in 305 B.C.E. (In other words, they were imperialist outsiders.) Many of their marriages were incestuous, with brothers marrying sisters - but not all the children born are known to have had both fathers and mothers who were Ptolemies.
We are not certain of the heritage of Cleopatra's mother or her paternal grandmother. That leaves 50% to 75% of her genetic heritage unknown and ripe for speculation.
Is there any evidence that either her mother or paternal grandmother was a black African? No. "We don't know the heritage of" means just that. We don't know.
Is there any evidence that either of those women were not black Africans? No, by the same reasoning. -
psteve321 — 14 years ago(November 08, 2011 06:34 AM)
Nobody really knows what she looked like.
Upon doing some research on her origins, I'm beginning to visualize her looking rather like your average italian female of today. Dark hair, dark eyes and olive skin.
The Ptolemy dynasty was descended from the Greek Macedonian Ptolemy Soter, established as ruler of Egypt by Alexander the Great's conquest of Egypt in 305 B.C.E. (In other words, they were imperialist outsiders.) Many of their marriages were incestuous, with brothers marrying sisters - but not all the children born are known to have had both fathers and mothers who were Ptolemies.
We are not certain of the heritage of Cleopatra's mother or her paternal grandmother. That leaves 50% to 75% of her genetic heritage unknown and ripe for speculation.
Is there any evidence that either her mother or paternal grandmother was a black African? No. "We don't know the heritage of" means just that. We don't know.
Is there any evidence that either of those women were not black Africans? No, by the same reasoning.
Yes we do know the heritage of both her mother and paternal grandmother and they were NOT black Africans. They were of Greek-Macedonian ancestry more then likely Ptolemaic Princess and Queens themselves because the Ptolemies were very xenophobic and didn't inter marry or produce heirs to their Dynasties with people who were NOT like them. Plus we have plenty of descriptions and depictions of what Cleopatra looked like and she was not black African or mixed black or whatever, all her ancient depictions from her lifetime clearly show a white woman with fair complexion and auburnish hair color, which by the way fair coloring was very common among the Ptolemies. -
foton — 21 years ago(February 11, 2005 02:01 PM)
I am Egyptian woman myself ,and please let me sort somethings about my country as it hurts me so much to read all those horrible misconcepts about Egypt & Egyptian people !
First of all Cleopatra is AN Egyptian Queen ,but she ruled Egypt during plotemey era . Some would wonder why she is Egyptian then???!!
Egypt is like a crucible it absorbs every new comer to it and after mixing with its people you are Egyptian to the bones . In fact people here still have the same features and skin colour of the ancient Egyptiansm and their way of life (Which Westerns like to call Pharoes ) Pharoes were ancient Egyptians also . And they are not black by the way . We don't discrimnate people here by the colour of their skin and catgories them into black & white !!!! You can find a blonde, a brunette and black walking down the street and they are all the same thing Egyptians .
Another thing I was so frustrated and disgusted about what other thnik of Cleopatra . Egyptian women are very strong and respectable and they are no prostiutes !!! It hurts any Egyptian woman to see such a degrading portayal of women in her country as this completely is bare from truth. -
JrJordan — 19 years ago(November 05, 2006 11:59 AM)
If Cleopatra hadn't murdered Arsinoe, Arsinoe would have murdered her. Besides, thats alot of conjecture. The only thing known for sure is that Cleopatra wanted Caesar to have Arsinoe killed, because she would be dangerous if left alive. And since Arsinoe was an active supporter of Caesar's murderers, Cleopatra was right.
Besides, it was part and parcel of being a Ptolemy to murder family members -
JrJordan — 19 years ago(November 14, 2006 02:25 PM)
They crowned her Queen of Egypt when they went East..and she declared that they were hero's for killing Ceasar. Thats pretty self-explanatory as to where she stood on the whole subject.
Besides the pointArsinoe was a nobody. Who cares that Cleopatra murdered her? I'd rather read stories and history books with Cleopatra in them, then Arsinoe. -
webmaster-1348 — 21 years ago(February 16, 2005 03:56 PM)
Cleopatra was not a Black women. She was a Greek born in Egypt. It's a common misconception since she was born in Egypt.
Trina said: <<< Actually, people in Egypt are Mid-Eastern>>>
The Ancient Egyptians were Black Africans, and not 'Middle Easterns', also know as Arabs. The Arabs along with Macedonians and Persians, ect invaded Egypt. None of those people are indigenous to Egypt. Arabs are NOT aboriginal people of Egypt.
Foton-You are NOT a decendent of Ancient Egyptians. And, yes, Egyptians were Black, much like the whole continent of Africa. I recommend you engage in some research beyond modern 'history'.
Jared-
We DO know who the ancient Egyptians were. They were Black. No amount of supremacy, whether its from Whites or Arabs or Blacks, will deter historical accuracy. -
ak6909 — 20 years ago(June 23, 2005 02:09 PM)
You need to study about the Ancient Egyptians a little further. Look at some photagraphs or something. By now everyone knows they were black. You were left behind or blind to the truth. Black is not just a skin colorit is a state of mind (ignorance). Even as mixed as the modern Egyptians are today they are still blackwhatever their shade. I suggest you read Chiekh Anta Diop's book "African Origins of Civilization: Myth or Reality". IT IS AN EYE OPENER!
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eby205 — 20 years ago(December 03, 2005 02:27 PM)
First of all, very little is known for certain about Cleopatra. She was definitely of Macedonian descent. Alexander the Great conquered Egypt and died at the age of 33, after which his general divided up his territory, and Ptolemy I got Egypt and started the Ptolemaic line. Cleopatra MIGHT have had some Egyptian blood in her; while generally the Ptolemies married their sisters, this was not always the case. However, it is extremely unlikely that Cleopatra was even slightly Egyptian, since Alexandria had a very large and very affluent Greek community under the Ptolemies. Contemporary depictions of herin busts, coins, etc., show a woman with bulgy eyes, a crooked nose, and a long neck (she was, after all, very inbred).
Despite her Greek descent, she was the first of the Ptolemies to speak colloquial Egyptian, and she clearly identified herself as Egyptianshe believed that she was a reincarnation of Isis (not unusual for Egyptian kings, who all identified themselves with Horus/Osiris and Amun-Re).
And really, no one knows whether the ancient Egyptians were white or black or Middle-Eastern. Previously to the Ptolemaic period, the Nubians (who were black) had invaded Egypt and served as kings for a short time, before being ousted by the Libyans (who were white). But technically both Nubians and Libyans were Egyptians, so ancient Egyptians' skin color really depended on where you were in Egypt. -
babydolphin8 — 20 years ago(December 20, 2005 08:05 AM)
The modern Egptians are direct descendants of the ancient Egyptians. The population only became Arabised in the 13th and 14th centuries etc adopting the muslim faith and the Arabic language just as the modern Iraqis are descentants from the Ancient Babylonians, Akkadians, Assyrians, Sumerians and the Lebanese from the Ancient Phoenicians. The ancient populations of the near east- from the tigris and euphrates to eastern meditteranean seaboard, just south of Anatolia- complextion was from dark to light brown with black straight or woolly hair, they were diffently not Caucasian Germanic/Nordic types so perpetuated by the Eurocentric film and television industry for so long. I remember the BBC did a historical documentary on Jesus as part of their promotion on the Radio Times they had an artist depiction of what an 1st century AD Jew/Hebrew would look like or what would Jesus look like we was bronzed-brown skin pigmentation with straight black hair not an European Caucasoid type.
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sexyonika21 — 17 years ago(October 26, 2008 08:31 PM)
this is only a recent thing the ancients never had ideas about black or white especially those from the medtereran sea who were olive brown skin color both egyptians and greek alike. and eventually the ptomely dynasty mixed they did mixed it was once in a while but they did. never listen to white historian who think white are supeior and never listen to a black historian who think blacks are superior. the ancients really did not have race and all that racism thing this a fairly recent idea about 500 years
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