How the heck did batman beat captain marvel??
-
CyberVerm — 16 years ago(October 01, 2009 04:00 AM)
Not to mention now he spun captain marvel around like a little child and threw him ass first into a batman missile that helps his dignity a bit.
Not to mention the beating he gives luthor at the end
I'm the guy who makes the "worst movie ever" thread in your favorite movie board -
kyrix — 16 years ago(October 01, 2009 02:21 PM)
Actually, Captain MArvel is one of the few people who can consistantly beat Superman. Like Marvel said, Superman is vulnerable to magic, and the lightning bolt that transforms him into Captain Marvel when he says "Shazam!" is magical. A common tactic is to grab Superman, hold him, and keep yelling Shazam! and letting the lightning strike him instead. It's every bit as effective as a kryptonite gattling gun
-
CyberVerm — 16 years ago(October 01, 2009 05:36 PM)
Except that when marvel tries that tactic superman eventualy gets away from marvel and puts him under his own lightning, turns him back to billy and covers his mouth so he cant yell shazam again.
in the past years superman and cap marvel have fought around 3 or 4 times counting movies, comics and cartoons. Each time they fought superman came out on top, so saying marvel constantly beats superman is pretty much a lie.
In recent memory.
Kingdom Come comic book = Captain was pretty much trying to kill superman while superman was trying to reason with captain marvel (marvel was evil at the time) eventualy marvel tried his "shazam! shazam! shazam!" spam tactic and superman turned him back to billy and covered his mouth.
the "Clash" episode in the Justice League unlimited series = Superman seemed more like the evil one in this one, even though there was no real evil one. This was a flat out ass whooping of epic proportions that superman gave marvel, which ended up having marvel using his one tactic that "allways works" against superman, the shazam, shazam, shazam spam, again, superman turned his ass back to a kid and covered his mouth.
the Alex Ross justice comic book = this one isnt really a fight, Marvel was just evil and went full force to try and pretty much kill superman, Superman just grabed the key to the fortress of solitude (big, big ass key) and hit the rampaging/crazy marvel and knocked his ass down, Marvel got up and yelled "Im going to kill you kryptonian!!!!" and launched himself again at Superman but before he got there green lantern stoped him and removed whatever was making him evil and he went back to normal.
And the last time I saw them fight was in superman/batman public enemies and that wasnt really a fight and it ended prematurely, Cap landed more hits but superman landed the allways important last blow and threw him into batmans missile, turning him back to a kid (that made no sense btw, so I dont count this as a fight)
So when you think about it, a lot of Marvel fans say that he "should" constantly beat superman but when they do fight in the comics, somehow superman allways comes out on top.. why? well because he is superman and they wont have superman lose like that. superman is cheap, we all know this. Just look at how Captain Atom and company were OWNING him, badly.. then all of a sudden he decides to make his whirlwind thing and owns pretty much everyone at the same time that made no sense but he is superman and the writers can do with him what they want.. which is why some people dislike the char but he is superman after all.
Another recent fight was between Superman Prime (an evil superman from another dimention that is ridiculously overpowered, cheap, lame writen and hillarious at the same time) against Black Adam (pretty much like Cap Marvel) and that was just embarassing but that doesnt count becase that version of superman was not vulnerable to magic so adam couldnt do squat except get owned.
Here is a recent fight between both of them -
confidential_75 — 16 years ago(October 02, 2009 03:46 AM)
"Actually, Captain MArvel is one of the few people who can consistantly beat Superman."
Not necessarily so. Black Adam is just as powerful as Captain Marvel, and he could not defeat Superman when they fought (forgot which comic). It was because as mentioned by Superman: "It is good when I am in a bad mood, I am facing someone who can take it." (something like that).
People fail to realize that Superman always hold his power back when he is facing an opponent; it goes without saying especially an ally who, in this case, is misguided.
"RESPECTING ONE'S OPINION IS THE PINNACLE OF MATURITY" -
kyrix — 16 years ago(October 02, 2009 06:50 AM)
I should clarify a few things about my statement. First, I don't read many DC or Marvel comics, except for a few recent events (Like Secret Invasion, Civil War, and Blackest Night) I'm a Gold Digger fan myself. But when I said he CAN consistantly beat Superman, I don't mean he has. He has the potential to do so, by exploiting Superman's weaknesses, and every source I've seen says that in terms of physical abilities, they're equals.
But let's not forget, "wisdom of Solomon" aside, that Captain Marvel is hosted by a pre-pubescent boy, wheras Superman is a grown man, with decades of experience against powerful opponents. I'm aware that Captain Marvel has likewise been around a long time, but he's not a consistant member (and I assume leader) of the Justice League. He doesn't hang out with Batman, and (I'l admit ignorance if I'm wrong) he doesn't handle as many galactic level opponents, and he sure as hell hasn't slugged it out with Doomsday.
Like I said, he has the potential to beat him consistantly, but potential doesn't always equal success. Superman was the first comic book superhero, and whether people like him or not, the fact that he's still as big as he is stands for something. EVERYONE knows who Superman is, but not nearly as many people know who Captain Marvel is. -
CyberVerm — 16 years ago(October 03, 2009 01:20 AM)
They are supposed to be pretty much neck and neck when it comes to speed and strenght, with superman having the extra perks like heat vision and cold breath/superbreath/xray vision/everythingelse vision and marvel has the magic abilities.
But when they do fight, it does seem superman is just a little bit stronger, even though some comics point that marvel is actualy faster, the common sense is that superman is a little bit faster if not equal.
Marvel's best weapon against superman is his magic lightning, which is his biggest weakness as well, so it's a toss up between these two, it allways has been, it's DC's titanic showdown after all, thats why they end up fighting whenever they are in the same comic book, over and over again.
If someone asked me who's powers I would like, I would pick superman, I dont know why, maybe because I know in the end I allways win due to cheapness.
I'm the guy who makes the "worst movie ever" thread in your favorite movie board -
DarkATX — 16 years ago(October 05, 2009 04:34 PM)
The one thing you fail to realize is this movie is based on a 6 issue comic run. If you read the comic book you would read that Capt. Marvel states that he's beaten Superman before. The Writer Jeph Loeb is good about his history thereCapt. Marvel is Superman's mirrorthey are similar but have complementary weakenesses - together they'd be unstoppable.
In the movie, the only allusion to that line was "It doesn't take the wisdom of Solomon to know you should stay down!" - go get your hands on a copy of the public enemies run - you'll see all the fun stuff that didn't make the film.
Now the animation world Superman is king and that's that so you'll rarely see Capt. Marvel beating Superman.
I'm just happy that DC is finally giving CM the attention he deserveshe's like Thor in the Marvel Universe - very underrated but a real good underdog to root for.
I heard a good set of issues to grab is Superman/Shazam: First Thunder - worth reading
-
steve1049 — 16 years ago(November 17, 2009 03:48 PM)
I don't understand how the whole speed thing is up for discussion. Superman freely admits Captain Marvel is faster than him in the Justice series. That's straight from the horses mouth. What Black Adam does against Superman isn't indicative of what Captain Marvel actually has done against Superman. It's not my opinion, it's a reference to fact stated by the writes of that comic series.
-
superturbo4 — 16 years ago(November 21, 2009 07:32 PM)
Except that when marvel tries that tactic superman eventualy gets away from marvel and puts him under his own lightning, turns him back to billy and covers his mouth so he cant yell shazam again.
in the past years superman and cap marvel have fought around 3 or 4 times counting movies, comics and cartoons. Each time they fought superman came out on top, so saying marvel constantly beats superman is pretty much a lie.
In recent memory.
Kingdom Come comic book = Captain was pretty much trying to kill superman while superman was trying to reason with captain marvel (marvel was evil at the time) eventualy marvel tried his "shazam! shazam! shazam!" spam tactic and superman turned him back to billy and covered his mouth.
the "Clash" episode in the Justice League unlimited series = Superman seemed more like the evil one in this one, even though there was no real evil one. This was a flat out ass whooping of epic proportions that superman gave marvel, which ended up having marvel using his one tactic that "allways works" against superman, the shazam, shazam, shazam spam, again, superman turned his ass back to a kid and covered his mouth.
the Alex Ross justice comic book = this one isnt really a fight, Marvel was just evil and went full force to try and pretty much kill superman, Superman just grabed the key to the fortress of solitude (big, big ass key) and hit the rampaging/crazy marvel and knocked his ass down, Marvel got up and yelled "Im going to kill you kryptonian!!!!" and launched himself again at Superman but before he got there green lantern stoped him and removed whatever was making him evil and he went back to normal.
And the last time I saw them fight was in superman/batman public enemies and that wasnt really a fight and it ended prematurely, Cap landed more hits but superman landed the allways important last blow and threw him into batmans missile, turning him back to a kid (that made no sense btw, so I dont count this as a fight)
So when you think about it, a lot of Marvel fans say that he "should" constantly beat superman but when they do fight in the comics, somehow superman allways comes out on top.. why? well because he is superman and they wont have superman lose like that. superman is cheap, we all know this. Just look at how Captain Atom and company were OWNING him, badly.. then all of a sudden he decides to make his whirlwind thing and owns pretty much everyone at the same time that made no sense but he is superman and the writers can do with him what they want.. which is why some people dislike the char but he is superman after all.
Another recent fight was between Superman Prime (an evil superman from another dimention that is ridiculously overpowered, cheap, lame writen and hillarious at the same time) against Black Adam (pretty much like Cap Marvel) and that was just embarassing but that doesnt count becase that version of superman was not vulnerable to magic so adam couldnt do squat except get owned.
Here is a recent fight between both of them
Agreed, smartest post in this thread by far!
While Superman is vulnerable to magic, its not in the actual sense of his dying of it flat out. He's just not as invulnerable to anything magically powered. Captain Marvel's powers are related to magic, but he himself isn't a magic caster/sorceror (although his recent role on the Rock Of Eternity taking the wizard's place kinda puts him there now!) just his powers of origin are related in that sense. Captain Marvel is a more physical 'Marvel' hence foe; for Superman to overcome in combat.
Captain Marvel himself probably find Superman a physical match and rivals him in power from a fictional 'super-science' perspective rather than a magical/supernatural one like 'Black Adam' who he is use to fighting as a foe.
Despite his power levels, writers from DC comics rarely put Captain Marvel up against the kinda foes Superman has tangled with that rival if not surpass his own awesome powers.
Captain Marvel can give Superman a run for his money, definitely! But no way would he
own
Superman outright! Hell far as the comic book and graphic novel references go; Captain Marvel was bloody
'owned'
in a fight/battle by Green Arrow in JLA&JSA: Virtue And Vice! When Green Arrow borrowed Wonder Woman's Lasso put it on one of his arrows' and wrapped it around Captain Marvel and asked him who gave him those fancy powers, lol! Can't lie with the Amazon's magic Lasso now can you, a "Shazam" later and even Marvel had just been owned by The Green Arrow! So magic's got its strengths and disadvantages, and Superman unlike Captain Marvel in that situation, wouldn't have that kind of problem!
Gotta hand to Warner's animated shows though. They know how to put Superman in some truly nasty slugfests with heroes and villains!
Superman Vs Captain Marvel
Superman vs Captain Atom
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o7jH8iVYUk&NR=1
Justice League vs The Justice Lords
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4B3wwfRF_k&feature=related
Justice league unlim -
superturbo4 — 16 years ago(November 21, 2009 07:50 PM)
Continued and concluded!
SUPERMAN vs. Mongul (FULL FIGHT!)
SUPERMAN vs. Drax (FULL FIGHT!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jyhYVj1PCQ&feature=related
SUPERMAN vs. Ten (FULL FIGHT!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csIXANkjAfo&feature=related
ST4
"He is one, we are three, it is the strength of three that will defeat himtogether. General Zod" -
Clifford_Starfox — 16 years ago(November 22, 2009 11:46 AM)
Uhhh, dude, just want to point out in your over-excessive posting of Superman fight links; the one you've posted as 'SUPERMAN vs. MONGUL' is his fight against Darkseid from Justice League.
Do you accept Optimus Prime as your lord and saviour? -
superturbo4 — 16 years ago(November 29, 2009 05:31 AM)
So what!
First off, if you paid any attention, i said Warner Brothers animation, hence that covers both Superman and Justice League series shows. Secondly, since i'm showcasing the best animated fights from these shows, i'd hardly call any of that over-excessive posting.
Why can anyone on Imdb.com ever enjoy anything without ever bitching??!
Use the sidebar on youtube and find the Mongul fight with Superman then smart guy, Jesus its not rocket science is it?
Stop complaining about absolultely nothing dude!
ST4
P.S. The original link? Its fixed now anyways!
"He is one, we are three, it is the strength of three that will defeat himtogether. General Zod" -
DarkATX — 16 years ago(November 29, 2009 04:40 PM)
OK, for the record don't EVER mix comic book canon with animation canon - they are and always will be 2 seperate things.
They have both beaten each other in the comicbooks which have a far greater and deeper history than recent animation lore.
Superman is DC's flagship character so he is kingand that bias was shown more in JLA more than anything elseBUTPublic Enemies seemed to lean the other way considering 'the castle' move Superman was forced to use.
In Public Enemies, others like Metallo and other enemies showed their true might against Superman. Seemed a little more truer to comicbook lore
Alex Ross when asked about Superman & Captain Marvel stated vaguely "he is the world's mightiest mortal" Actually, it was Alex who pushed to have Capt. Marvel in the story being a big fan of the TV show in the 70's.
If you look at Kingdom Come againSuperman flies toward the bomb - Billy Batson changes back Capt. Marvel - flies towards Superman, catches him and throws him down to the ground with one hand.
So he's just as strong and even faster since he can travel beyond light speed to go to the wizard's sacred mountainalso if you look at the fight Capt. Marvel is brainwashed and just has this weird grin on his face the entire time like he's messing with Supermanenjoying it.
When one fights to kill and a must exert one's self - they seldom smile doing it.
But in the end, this is just Comicbook fiction and DC has only one true flagship character who stands alone and it is and always will be Superman. -
CyberVerm — 16 years ago(December 06, 2009 12:32 PM)
In that fight Marvel was grining but he was clearly trying to hurt/kill superman while superman knew well that his best shot was to reason with billy instead of beating him because that would take ages
when billy turns back to marvel and flies up superman turns back surprised and slows down and thats why marvel catches him.
Either way, we all know superman wouldnt have died from that bomb blast.. he just wouldnt have and billy did
I'm the guy who makes the "worst movie ever" thread in your favorite movie board