Dream role or sequence….
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — Saoirse Ronan
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 19, 2016 05:22 PM)
O.K. I've thought many times about a dream role or sequence for Saoirse. I'm sure all of you have many ideas. My hope was a big Hollywood studio would remake Joan of Arc someday with an incandecsent Saoirse in the lead. Or how about an epic story of the incredibly tragic "Great Famine" in Ireland. There are so many possibilities.
Here is one sequence in an imagined film: Saoirse plays a cultured daughter of a Polish intellectual who was executed by the Nazis during the initial occupation of Poland in WW2. She was studying classical music at the university before being shipped to a prison camp. In this scene, she has already experienced the unspeakable horrors suffered by individuals interned, but due to the location of her barracks, she hears the following beautiful voice from the commandant's quarters as she looks out the window and just emotes for over six minutes:
http://tinyurl.com/hbs4voo
Hope I'm not overly dramatic. -
jlent — 9 years ago(September 19, 2016 05:56 PM)
OK, let's work this through. For Saoirse's character to be near the commandant's quarters she couldn't be in the camp proper, she'd have to be a worker for him, the way Meryl Streep was for the Auschwitz commandant in Sophie's Choice.
But six minutes of emoting is a long time. Take this sequence, from Bergman's Persona, 1966. This is only about a minute and it's aided by the cinematic brilliance of cinematographer Sven Nykvist:
or this famous section from Shawshank Redemption, it's only a couple of minutes long and there are lots of other things going on.
But I'm game. What, exactly, would she be doing? -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 19, 2016 06:30 PM)
I didn't want to be accused of plagiarizing from Schindler's List.
She would be reacting to every bit of the music with her amazing eyes/face by conveying the awe, sadness, joy and deep feeling and appreciation of the beauty represented by that voice, the wonderful expression of life with the obvious juxtaposition of the pure evil and horror surrounding her. -
canvro — 9 years ago(September 19, 2016 06:58 PM)
I'm not here with ideas yet (sorry
), but I'd like to point out that to me, Joan of Arc is already a dream role I'd want to watch her, that with the proper combination of pressure, production-director can be a devastating and powerful result, and may I say it will leave a very profound mark in cinema. A great potential in that one. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 19, 2016 08:58 PM)
Absolutely. I've thought about it for a long time. The last version didn't do justice to the great story and character. BTW, I haven't heard back from the guy offering TC thing. I guess I'll have to send another email to see if he has the goods.
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purple_lemon — 9 years ago(September 20, 2016 01:28 AM)
I would love to see Saoirse in the plum lead role as Dorothea Brooks in a remake of the television costume drama mini-series 'Middlemarch' (last made back in 1994).
Set around 1830 in England it is chiefly about Dorothea, a young well off and idealistic woman who is distressed by the living conditions of the poor on her Uncle's estate. Partly in a reaction against her families preferred choice of a suitable husband for her (the owner of the neighbouring Estate) she marries a much older man, almost entirely out of admiration for his refined and scholarly mind. But she lives to deeply regret it.
The story is even better than 'Pride and Prejudice' in my opinion and Saoirse would be perfect for the role.
The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth. -
Poetswan — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 02:38 PM)
I Love drama Steve
I also, like Jlent, think a 6 min scene would be too much, but how about something like the durkirk scene in Atonement? Imagine as she walks in the middle of a gruesome scene, the camera following turned to her so we can see her face, but also the scene around, till we see she raising her arm, then cut. Next scene we see she touching the shoulder of the man playing the song. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 03:55 PM)
Good. I suspect the posters have a variety of ideas related to the topic. I really think she could do anything despite the genre.
We had a decent discussion years ago about lead vs. supporting roles. While I'm enthusiastic about her taking any good role, I'm actually very happy she has decided to concentrate almost exclusively on lead ones in her film career. -
purple_lemon — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 04:59 PM)
Yes Saoirse as a bad girl. I wish they had made her character in 'Brooklyn' more of a sinner than a saint. It would have made the film so much more complex and interesting.
The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 21, 2016 07:15 PM)
There was one particular thing in the book that certainly can be viewed as more realistic when she returns to Ireland. However, I feel confident in my belief the director/writer were concerned the audience might have turned against Saoirse's Eilis if they had gone down this road.
I'm fairly savvy about what regular cinema goers like from having been devoted to actually watching a lot of films for many years, and the audiences were definitely nervous when Eilis began to get too comfortable in her return home. They adored Tony quite a bit. For example, in one showing a guy yelled out
"open the letter"
when she picked it up and looked at it in the entranceway of her mom's home. In addition, I heard a number of people gasp in multiple showings when Eilis opens the little draw containing Tony's unopened letters.
The novel is sort of shocking, sad and abrupt in the manner of its ending. The truth is she was really forced to go back due to the social mores of the times. The irony in the novel (or one I guess) is though she made great strides in her life and became a woman, the final decision wasn't one from her heart but more or less imposed on her. It harkened back to the beginning when she discovered at a home dinner that her mom and sister had already made arrangements with the priest to send her to America. They loved her very much, but it was so sad. -
purple_lemon — 9 years ago(September 22, 2016 06:11 AM)
Call me a hard case but just because the common herd like cozy and predictable doesn't mean they should always get it! My reactions seem to be at odds with that sort of thinking.
I was actually annoyed by Eilis' relationship with Tony. It seemed as though she fell for the first guy who showed any interest in her when it was clear she could have and should have done better for herself. And then it was like Tony pressured her into a quick marriage because he couldn't wait to have sex with her, which made him a selfish jerk.
There was one particular thing in the book that certainly can be viewed as more realistic when she returns to Ireland.
I don't know what you're referring to in particular there but something that struck me was that if Ireland was anything like Australia back in the 1950's then the fact that Eilis had married an Italian guy would have been disapproved of very much. Of course marrying a black guy would have been unforgivable but Italians or any southern Europeans were not regarded well either.
And another thing if Eilis' mother and her sister Rose sent Eilis to America so that she could have a better life and all she did when she got there was to marry an Italian guy and then presumably have ten children as Catholics did in those days she might just as well have stayed in Ireland and done the same thing there!
The novel is sort of shocking, sad and abrupt in the manner of its ending. The truth is she was really forced to go back due to the social mores of the times.
I thought that the same thing happened to her in the film. Once her secret marriage had been discovered the game was up and she had to go back to America.
What I would have liked to see was a more compromised relationship between Eilis and Tony where she began to see that Tony had pressured her into sex and then marriage and she had begun to resent it. That would have then made sense of her subsequent actions when she returned to Ireland and seemed to seriously entertain the idea of getting romantically involved with Jim.
Also at the end of the film I would have loved to have seen her take a leaf out of the book of the girl who befriended her on her first voyage to America by hooking up with some good looking well off male passenger so she could enjoy the return trip in first class! That would have shown that Eilis was no longer going to allow herself to be taken for granted and used and left open the notion that she might have decided to give Tony the flick and start her new life in America all over again.
The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 22, 2016 08:04 AM)
I respect your differing opinion purple lemon. Even here on this board, we don't all agree about the films to date in her career.
I like to judge films for what they are, but I'm aware of some criticism Brooklyn received especially from general audience members. Letterboxed has a bunch of mostly react111cions by regular filmgoers and some stuff from critics. I've kept track since Brooklyn debuted to get a sense of how people felt about it. Percentage-wise, only a very small number gave it a low grade with a larger group feeling it was decent. However, the largest group rated it good to great based upon the number of stars and comments.
I didn't mean to withhold info in my post: Eilis had a physical relationship with Jim during her return to Ireland. At the end of the novel, in a blink she's sitting on a train heading for the port where the ship sails for America. The filmmakers couldn't do the relationship thing nor the ending from the novel. They gave the audience what it wanted and then tied a nice little bow on it.
However, they were essentially true to the essence of the source material because we feel the agonizing decision she has to make largely due to Saoirse's beautiful performance.
On Twitter and wherever I could read reactions about her turn, I frequently read the word "real" in connection with how the viewers experienced her performance overall. I believe I felt the same way after many viewings of the film. The scene where she's walking in a yellow dress with her school grades in hand was remarkable because we see and feel how radically this young woman has changed with regard to her new life in New York. I feel her skill was mostly in how effective her subtleness conveyed everything we needed to know and feel as viewers.
Tony was a more complex character in the novel. He certainly wasn't a bad guy of course, but they were some things Eilis wasn't sure about when contemplating their relationship.
When my niece came to visit, the film was still running, and I took her and my mom to see it. I was very surprised at dinner to learn she had intuited almost everything that happen in the novel despite not having read it. That got me to thinking about the film as having more layers rather than just a simple and straightforward narrative.
I think for a 10.5 million dollar budget, one could check off a lot of admirable boxes with this film. For example, it had great writing that didn't blow off the minor characters. The film looked great visually and had fine art direction and costuming. I love the score as well. And of course, she gave a beautiful, knock-out performance. -
purple_lemon — 9 years ago(September 23, 2016 06:16 PM)
Eilis had a physical relationship with Jim during her return to Ireland.
Ah well that makes more sense doesn't it.
I don't hate the film but it frustrates me because it really could have been very good if they hadn't tweaked the life out of it to make it safe and bland for the undiscriminating audience. The old commercial "feed them muck" mentality ruled over story telling integrity in this case.
The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 23, 2016 08:25 PM)
They tried to find a balance where the most important aspects of her character were present along with the main thrust of the novel. It can be challenging as you're well aware to take a 262 page novel and properly represent it in the visual medium of film. I really believe they wanted the audience to have a positive and satisfying experience with the film and not be left with the more melancholy wrap-up in the book.
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purple_lemon — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 12:49 AM)
To each their own. You liked 'Brooklyn' well enough not to be too bothered by its flaws which is something I couldn't quite manage. And yet I liked 'Lost River' well enough not to be too bothered by its flaws which I imagine is something many people wouldn't have been able to manage.
You said that you love period pieces. I am very fond of them myself and have collected quite a few over the years on DVD mostly and on Blu-ray. What are some of your favourites?
The Players of The Game are the scum of the earth. -
Steve7216 — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 05:39 AM)
Don't get me going a238bout "Lost Film.I mean River."
There are so many I've loved through the years, and now that you've brought it up, it reminds me of the numerous titles I haven't yet seen.
I loved "Remains of the Day" partly because Hopkins and Thompson gave all-time great performances. It was excruciating to watch Hopkins character because you just wanted to shak5b4e the guy and say
"it's right here in front of you man!"
I also loved "A Room With A View", a film I haven't seen for some time. "The House of Mirth" was one of those films I believe was underrated. It has a devastating ending. "Amadeus" was a great film with a tremendous performance by F. Murray Abraham. I loved "Elizabeth" with Cate Blanchett, a film that could be considered her coming out party.
I should mention a couple of smaller films: one many years ago, "The Wings of the Dove" has a lovely performance by Alison Elliot. Alison should have had a much bigger film career as she had a sort of inner beauty along with very fine acting skills. A more recent "little" title I enjoyed was called "Belle." GuGu Mbatha-Raw should be a star someday. The gorgeous Sarah Gadon had a small supporting role in this film based upon a very intriguing true story. BTW, I thought Gadon was really terrific in the recent "Indignation."
There are plenty of others I'm just not thinking about right now, but I'll come up with many more when I have a little time to reflect.