Sexual tension between young Charlie and old Charlie?
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — Shadow of a Doubt
danskelle — 18 years ago(July 17, 2007 10:21 AM)
It just seemed to me that there was a little more going on between the two of them than what should be. Why does, in the beginning of the film, young Charlie feel that her uncle is going to save her from inevitable boredom or mediocrity, when he doesn't even live there - what has gone on in the past between them? Then, when he arrives, she gushes and fawns all over him, and he does the same to her by commenting on her dress (her appearance) and then saving HER gift to give to her in private and it is an emerald ring, which is normally something a suitor would give a girl? Plus, she tells him they are more than uncle and niece, they are like twins, but you get the feeling that this isn't exactly what she meant to say, she is feeling more for him than she should be. I almost felt like her trepidation in not turning him in was a choice between her uncle that she was in love with, and her new boyfriend, the detective. When she "spurns" him to go along with the detectives, and starts avoiding him, like you would a jilted lover, then he gets back at her by attempting to hurt/kill her, but he grabs her and when he pulls her close, you feel that instead of trying to twist her wrist or arm, or strangle her, he might kiss her instead. The embracing/grabbing and the physical contact and proximity between the two of them is almost palpable. Their scene in the bar seemed more like a date, and also her pride in being seen with her "Uncle Charlie" and other girls' envy, when they were walking around town, also confirms this.
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GarryJohal — 18 years ago(July 31, 2007 03:14 AM)
oh there was definitely a lot of sexual tension between them. you could cut through it with a knife. it's definitely intentional as hitchcock was quite a perfectionist. he controlls every element in his films. why the tension? probably some kind of subtext of incest or a suggestions that there may be more to the relationship than meets the eye. also hitchcock was a very well learned man and he often deliberately incorporated symbols and motifs relating to freud's concepts of oedipal psychosexual tension, the idea of the virgin/femme fatale character, succubus and so on.
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smitty1941 — 17 years ago(April 05, 2008 06:13 AM)
I think you're right about families being closer. Nowadays, that kind of conduct might spell bad things, but back in the 40s, they didn't even think that way. So I really don't think any such relationship was intended by Hitchcock or anyone else. They didn't think along that line. I think Charlie and Uncle Charlie were just extremely close.
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ichimaru — 18 years ago(September 22, 2007 08:22 PM)
I disagree about that being able to be attributed to families being different in the 1940s. Certainly, there were differences, but their body language is anything but familial to me. Their body language and expressions and even their dialog said their feelings were not simply familial, different times and attitudes don't come into it at all.
It's obvious it was purposefully done and skillfully too. It would have been noticed just as much back then as it is now because it's so blatantly obvious. Trying to attribute it to misunderstanding and changing times is pretty much an insult to the movie itself. It's a complete underestimation of the script and everything in it. -
lily_slade — 17 years ago(April 10, 2008 10:43 PM)
OHHHH I totally think there was stronge sexual tention between them you could just feel it while you watched it. Many times I thought that Uncle Charlie was going to kiss young Charlie. In a way you could tell they both wished in way that they could be together. And share their lips on one another. Until the whole murder thing came out then it all went down hill. Just like a relationship would if something were to come inbetween it. I think its was done tastefully in the relationship between Uncle Charlie and Young Charlie. It was directed perfectily and beautifully throughout the whole movie. Good stuff. You don't get movies like this anymore. What am I saying I'm 18 we've never had movies like this. Thats why I watch Turner Classic Movies all the time.
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crachelm — 17 years ago(December 17, 2008 11:59 AM)
I certainly noticed the tension. I didn't know if it was intentional by Hitchcock or if they were dating in real life and couldn't hide it or what, but I think it's undeniable that it's there.
"She plays like a Stradivarius, man," said Mr. Dobkin of Rachel McAdams.
R.I.P. Heath Ledger -
FrameXFrame — 18 years ago(September 03, 2007 07:18 AM)
Yes, I picked up on that sexual tension the first time I ever saw the movie. I think of it as Uncle Charlie representing the dangerous but seductive side of life. Yes, indeed, sexual tension that "could be cut with a knife." Plus, Hitchcock has Uncle Charlie toss his hat on young Charlie's bed, which could be seen as a "claiming territory" move.
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jigsawsXapprentice — 18 years ago(September 13, 2007 07:57 AM)
Yeah, I'm watching it now in class and it does seem that Hitchcock made their relationship more sexual then an uncle and a neice usually are. I'm not really sure why I think he did that, but I'm only halfway through the movie.
In Nomine Patris, Et Filii, Et Spiritus Sancti -
MrBlondNYC — 18 years ago(September 23, 2007 12:38 AM)
Not in a lustful sense but young Charlie was clearly attracted to Uncle Charlie. For example, when young Charlie is lying in bed playing with her hair while she's thinking about Uncle Charlie. And young Charlie loved what people may have thought as they walked down the street holding hands.
Tony Soprano: Everything turns to sh-t. -
capricious_nature — 18 years ago(September 23, 2007 03:42 AM)
This has probably been mentioned, but also note that the first time the garage door is closed on Young Charlie, it is just after a declaration of love from the detective. Part of Uncle Charlie's attempted murder of her is implicitly inspired by sexual jealousy, not just fear of discovery. He sees his power over her slipping as she moves towards a more natural sexual/romantic relationship and away from their "connection." Incest, murder and insanity in small town America
~I cannot fiddle, but I can make a great state of a small city.~