Was the murder of the astronauts not the first intention?
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Mrpinkeye — 13 years ago(September 17, 2012 09:16 PM)
just watched it for the first time
i thought the whole heat shield thing was a unplanned mistake and when it happened they decided they had to kill them as the news would report them dead. before that they were going to be able to return them
also thought they were killing them asap when they were found via helicopter at the end,making the flare scenes have more meaning than just that theyd been caught -
henrimaine — 13 years ago(February 09, 2013 07:19 AM)
I understood the whole thing a bit differently. The way I understood it, there was no empty spaceship entering Earth's atmosphere, the Huston space station was just connected to some computer that fooled the space station into thinking there was something flying in space. The landing module, with three astronauts in it, was going to be planted somewhere, so they could be picked up by the rescue team. But since the conspirators saw that the astronauts would probably not keep quiet, they decided to stage the shield failure. I'm not sure my interpretation is correct, but that's how I saw it while watching the movie.
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cultfilmfreaksdotcom — 13 years ago(February 12, 2013 07:01 PM)
I think they were killed simply because of how the stuff leading up to them being captured was filmed, very ominously.
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joey_pesci — 13 years ago(March 09, 2013 01:39 PM)
I think killing them always seemed like an odd idea cause surely the lose of the astronauts in a "space accident" would be just as much an excuse to cancel the space program as them not really being able to make it to Mars.
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djsnafu23 — 10 years ago(August 04, 2015 11:00 AM)
That's my main gripe with the movie too- this makes no sense to me.
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subcarrier — 12 years ago(May 27, 2013 10:16 AM)
I honestly think they were killed when they were found. They could never be seen again or the whole cover-up is blown.
The heat shield failure was definately not planned. The astronauts were being taken to the splashdown point when the capsule was lost and the jet was turned around. The G men were waiting to see if the astronauts were really dead before killing them- which is when they got wise and escaped.
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RosieT20 — 12 years ago(November 16, 2013 02:39 AM)
I think they were killed when they were found too. I didn't want to believe it, but all the evidence does point to it.
However, it was - imo - a plot flaw. It would have been sheer stupidity to kill two whilst one was free to tell the tale. -
SuperCatMonkey — 12 years ago(November 23, 2013 07:20 AM)
Hmmmm It's a very good point. I don't know if I'd go so far as to call it a plot hole in the movie; it has more to do with the bad guys' strategy. It's one thing to get caught faking the Mars mission. It's another to get caught killing people to cover it up - which they had already done (the communications guy from MC). Maybe at that point it didn't matter any more. They had to get rid of them anyway.
The other thing to consider is that if this were intentional, it happened above Hal Holbrook's head. He was genuinely surprised when the heat shield separated. It was clear at that point that they all had to die. If it were left up to him, the astronauts could have talked him out of it and just gone public with the whole thing. It wasn't up to him any longer, though.
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spookyrat1 — 12 years ago(December 13, 2013 04:34 AM)
As one of the earlier posters notes the taglines give the answer anyway.
But it's clear in Kelloway's face and body language that the recaptured astronauts were terminated, as was the disappearing Dr Whittier. Loose ends would be creating more liabilities, than they already had. -
meddle2010 — 12 years ago(October 01, 2013 04:08 PM)
Right. Because this movie is inspired in the "conspiracy theory of the fake moon landing". So: Were the astronauts from the missions Apolo XI to XVII killed after they return to the Earth alive? The answer is No. But the theory says astronauts (as well as other people involved in the fake mission) are forced to keep silence. Therefore the failure of the instruments indicated that the mission ended before return safely to Earth, so the only 3 people that couldn't be seen ever were the astronauts, and that's the reason that the NASA men needed to kill them.
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SuperCatMonkey — 12 years ago(November 15, 2013 07:20 PM)
I don't see the point of holding onto them. I've never considered that they survived long after being captured.
As far as the heat shield separation goes, I've never seen any reason to believe either way. The first time I saw it I assumed it was a glitch of some kind, but later considered it may have been planned. I don't know of any reason to rule out either story.
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walkerus — 12 years ago(December 14, 2013 06:35 PM)
After viewing this movie several times (last evening being the latest) I think that they would be holding the two captured 'would be astronauts' until the third was captured, then they would be killed.
Why would they be killed in cold blood if Brubaker may suddenly turn up (as he indeed did), then not only would the future plans for space expenditure be thrown out (which is what forced this charade in the first place) but all the top people would be up for murder and many would be spending many years in prison.
The murder of the friend of Elliot Gould, who worked out the scam on his own and then disappeared, could probably not be proven.
I also think that the heat-shield failure was not expected and because of that the charade could no longer be played-out and the three had to be eliminated. After all, the actual mission had been successful (in the eyes of the world) and old-glory had been unfurled on Mars, and the President had given in his blessing.
I find this movie has a top conspiracy plot that will not date in time. -
walkerus — 12 years ago(December 14, 2013 06:40 PM)
After viewing this movie several times (last evening being the latest) I think that they would be holding the two captured 'would be astronauts' until the third was captured, then they would be killed.
Why would they be killed in cold blood if Brubaker may suddenly turn up (as he indeed did), then not only would the future plans for space expenditure be thrown out (which is what forced this charade in the first place) but all the top people would be up for murder and many would be spending many years in prison.
The murder of the friend of Elliot Gould, who worked out the scam on his own and then disappeared, could probably not be proven.
I also think that the heat-shield failure was not expected and because of that the charade could no longer be played-out and the three had to be eliminated. After all, the actual mission had been successful (in the eyes of the world) and old-glory had been unfurled on Mars, and the President had given in his blessing.
I find this movie has a top conspiracy plot that will not date in time. -
RosieT20 — 12 years ago(December 15, 2013 01:47 AM)
I totally agree with your first sentence, and made the same point myself. I just wish the film had taken that route, if only for the sake of logic! Because they didn't show the other two astronauts, I fear they were killed, and that wouldn't have happened until they had all three. Unless they were all mindless and illogical villains!
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L0GAN5 — 11 years ago(June 21, 2014 08:45 AM)
Both interpretations are valid. It was the 70s; the decade of ambiguity. The ominous tone suggests that the astronauts were killed, but if they were killed immediately the film could just have easily shown that. The reason they don't show them being taken away or killed is to purposefully leave the astronauts' fates "open".
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davidmrenton — 11 years ago(August 07, 2014 07:23 AM)
something to point out, when they escape , to the Jet aircraft, the guy standing by the plane doesn't seem suspicious or wary that the three Astronaut's are there without guard. at that point there is no reason to kill them as the constant threat hang's over their families safety in case they feel the need to talk.
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davidemistero — 11 years ago(February 24, 2015 02:36 PM)
Sorry for my eng
i dunno the first, i've always thought that tey were killed on sight but i've read a lots of theores so i dunno but
For the second question you forgot that they were taking the astronauts on the island so i don't think the shield stuff was already riggedand then that evil guy looked really surprised so i don't think was already decided. Maybe as you said, if everything would have been ok they would have used the treathing to family to keep their mouths closed -
puirt-a-beul — 10 years ago(August 15, 2015 09:41 PM)
Well, I think the first two were killed on sight.
Nuke the site from orbit only way to be sure.
And I think the deaths were always part of the plan. At the outset, the plotters threatened to kill the three families or at least bluffed that they would either way, as soon as they did that, there was no going back. Imagine if they went through with their fakery, and brought the three astronauts back alive, and then one or more of the men decided to trade his career and reputation for the need to tell the truth? There would have been a massive public meltdown. The plotters simply couldn't take that chance, if only in the interests of self-preservation.
So they had to fake the landing and the
nearly
-getting-home, to make the program look like a
near
-success and justify further funding. But killing the three astronauts was the only way to guarantee that the word would never get out about the plot. (No doubt the few involved in the actual photography were quietly
disappeared
as well.) So I think the heat-shield failure was always planned; it was a credible way to contain the chance of exposure without bringing the mission into technical disrepute. The plotters' one big mistake (without which the movie wouldn't have had a Third Act,
natch
) was in not killing the astronauts immediately, once the heat-shield had "failed".
As for the fugitive astronauts, the safest, most reliable course of action was to kill each one separately, as soon as he was found. And presumably, hide them in the desert and leave predators to dispose of the remains. Take their suits, probably, and any identifying personal effects; maybe cut off their hands and heads. Far less risky than carting bodies with them, whether alive or dead, and completely deniable should anything go wrong.
tl;dr :
Kill tham! Kill them all!!!
You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.