Black Confederates ????????
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NoahBody — 14 years ago(October 05, 2011 11:13 AM)
And just how many of these guys were there compared to the tens of thousands who fought for the Union?
Where are the monuments to any black confederates?
This is a fallacy called Moving the goal post. Your side lost the original debate, so you attempt to change (move the goal) the debate. -
Hancock_the_Superb — 14 years ago(May 31, 2011 06:05 PM)
There were attempts to organize black regiments at various times, but until the final months of the war the Confederate government vetoed this. A Louisiana militia regiment was organized entirely of blacks early in the war, but once Richmond heard about it they ordered it disbanded immediately. Supposedly there was a company of Virginia blacks who served with Lee in the final days of the war but they never saw combat.
There were cases of individual blacks fighting with the Confederates, but these were few and far between. Unless you count slaves conscripted to build fortifications, dig trenches, etc. which isn't exactly voluntary. Certainly compared to the 180,000+ blacks who fought with the Union army, they were a negligible factor in the war.
Two reasons why slaves might have initially supported the Confederacy. One, simple patriotism: they probably shared their master's view of an outside threat to their country and rallied around the Confederate flag. Keep in mind that slaves had served in the Revolutionary War and the War of 1812 too. Two, because the Union government did not make the war overtly anti-slavery until September 1862, so the alternative initially wasn't necessarily better. On the other hand, after Union troops began to occupy the South, and certainly after the Proclamation, most slaves lost any loyalty to their masters and home states, whether or not they openly rebelled or took up arms.
"That's what the elves call Justice of the Unicorn!" -
NoahBody — 14 years ago(October 05, 2011 11:21 AM)
There were attempts to organize black regiments at various times, but until the final months of the war the Confederate government vetoed this. A Louisiana militia regiment was organized entirely of blacks early in the war, but once Richmond heard about it they ordered it disbanded immediately. Supposedly there was a company of Virginia blacks who served with Lee in the final days of the war but they never saw combat.
ehem
Noted Examples:- The "Richmond Howitzers" were partially manned by black militiamen. They saw action at 1st Manassas (or 1st Battle of Bull Run) where they operated battery no. 2. In addition two black regiments, one free and one slave, participated in the battle on behalf of the South. Many colored people were killed in the action, recorded John Parker, a former slave.
- At least one Black Confederate was a
non-commissioned officer. James Washington, Co. D 35th Texas Cavalry, Confederate States Army, became its 3rd Sergeant. Higher ranking black commissioned officers served in militia units
, but this was on the State militia level (Louisiana) and not in the regular C.S. Army. - Free
black musicians, cooks,
soldiers
and teamsters earned the same pay as white confederate privates
. This was not the case in the Union army where blacks did not receive equal pay. At the Confederate Buffalo Forge in Rockbridge County, Virginia,
skilled black workers "earned on average three times the wages of white Confederate soldiers and more than most Confederate army officers
($350- $600 a year). - Dr. Lewis Steiner, Chief Inspector of the United States Sanitary Commission while observing Gen. "Stonewall" Jackson's occupation of Frederick, Maryland, in 1862: "Over 3,000 Negroes must be included in this number [Confederate troops]. These were clad in all kinds of uniforms, not only in cast-off or captured United States uniforms, but in coats with Southern buttons, State buttons, etc. These were shabby, but not shabbier or seedier than those worn by white men in the rebel ranks.
Most of the Negroes had arms, rifles, muskets, sabers, bowie-knives, dirks, etc..and were manifestly an integral portion of the Southern Confederate Army."
Frederick Douglas reported, There are at the present moment many Colored men in the Confederate Army doing duty not only as cooks, servants and laborers, but real soldiers, having musket on their shoulders, and bullets in their pockets, ready to shoot down any loyal troops and do all that soldiers may do
to destroy the Federal government and build up that of therebels.
6. Black and white militiamen returned heavy fire on Union troops at the Battle of Griswoldsville (near Macon, GA). Approximately 600 boys and elderly men were killed in this skirmish.
7. In 1864, President Jefferson Davis approved a plan that proposed the emancipation of slaves, in return for the official recognition of the Confederacy by Britain and France. France showed interest but Britain refused.
8.
The Jackson Battalion included two companies of black soldiers. They saw combat at Petersburg under Col. Shipp.
"My men acted with utmost promptness and goodwillAllow me to state sir that they behaved in an extraordinary acceptable manner."
9. Recently the National Park Service, with a recent discovery, recognized that blacks were asked to help defend the city of Petersburg, Virginia and were offered their freedom if they did so. Regardless of their official classification, black Americans performed support functions that in today's army many would be classified as official military service. The successes of white Confederate troops in battle, could only have been achieved with the support these loyal black Southerners.
10. Confederate General John B. Gordon (Army of Northern Virginia) reported that all of his troops were in favor of Colored troops and that its adoption would have greatly encouraged the army.
Gen. Lee was anxious to receive regiments of black soldiers.
The Richmond Sentinel reported on 24 Mar 1864, Nonewill deny that our servants are more worthy of respect than the motley hordes which come against us. Bad faith [to black Confederates] must be avoided as an indelible dishonor.
11. In March 1865, Judah P. Benjamin, Confederate Secretary Of State, promised freedom for blacks who served from the State of Virginia. Authority for this was finally received from the State of Virginia and on April 1st 1865, $100 bounties were offered to black soldiers. Benjamin exclaimed, Let us say to every Negro who wants to go into the ranks, go and fight, and you are freeFight for your masters and you shall have your freedom. Confederate Officers were ordered to treat them humanely and protect them from "injustice and oppression".
12. A quota was set for 300,000 black soldiers for the Confederate States Colored Troops.
83% of Richmond's male slave population volunteered for duty
. A special ball was held in Richmond to raise money for uniforms for these men. Before Richmond fell, black Confederates in gray uni -
digitaldiva — 14 years ago(October 11, 2011 08:51 PM)
Hi NoahBody,
In the newest episode of the PBS television show, History Detectives, broadcast a fascinating story about Black Confederates based on the Chandler Family tintype that had been shown on the Antiques Roadshow. While it makes it clear that very few black actually carried arms for the Confederacy, I think you'll find it interesting. -
mspibb — 14 years ago(October 30, 2011 10:19 AM)
Your article is certainly full of good examples of individual (and also multiple) incidents of colored men participating in the war however, the bottom line is not until the very end of the war when manpower and hope was at it's lowest "Authority for this was finally received from the State of Virginia and on April 1st 1865" did the Confederate Government authorize the formation of black regiments.
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IronBrig4 — 14 years ago(January 23, 2012 04:34 AM)
That's just neo-Confederate propaganda, my friend. It's something you must be very careful to avoid. Most of your claims take place in 1864 or beyond, when the South was scraping the bottom of the barrel for manpower. A deathbed conversion if there ever was one. Yes, there were some blacks who fought for the rebels. Yes, there were certainly a lot of black laborers who performed duties around camp. No, the rebel government never seriously considered equipping large numbers of black soldiers until the end of the war. Regarding the book "Black Confederates and Afro-Yankees," the author himself admits that only approximately 300 blacks in Virginia received compensation for their services, out of 500,000 total blacks in the state. He goes further to state that there were far more Virginia blacks who were willing to support the Union, and that black Confederates were a minority within a minority. I also have access to reviews from professional historians, and their reviews are largely unfavorable. Here's a bit from Dr. Steven Miller of the University of Maryland. Source: The Journal of American History, June 1996.
"Attempting to restore Afro-Confederates to the historical stage, Jordan overcorrects, assigning marginal bit players to the role of principals. Much of his case rests on anecdotal evidence, to which he gives a less skeptical reading than it deserves. He is unduly inclined to regard public avowals of Confederate patriotism by black people as sincere and voluntary acts and to downplay the coercion and terror that shaped their response to a war to preserve slavery."
And if you're using the SCV to back up your sources, I'd seriously re-examine them and use a real book. You might as well be using Stormfront sources for commenting on a movie about World War Two. The SCV used to simply be a heritage organization like Daughters of the American Revolution, but now it's just a club for deluded Lost Causers.
Furthermore, black Union soldiers were eventually given equal pay. It took until summer of 1864 but it was done. The rebels' official policy towards captured black soldiers was also atrocious and reflected their attitudes toward blacks in general. -
jaynekranc — 13 years ago(August 02, 2012 09:22 PM)
How did I miss this fabulous post?
Black Confederate soldiers were also mentioned in Ken Burns Civil War Series. I just watched it again with my daughter, who had it on a list of things to watch before starting her US History class. -
madetwolast — 14 years ago(June 03, 2011 05:20 PM)
I'm not surprised. As someone else mentioned, there were black slave owners.
Even back in Africa, tribe members traded/sold other tribe members to whites to be carried to America.
Hell, black on black crime is high today. Very little respect for one another apparently.
So I'm not surprised that there were Black Confederates. It figures. -
bryanac625 — 14 years ago(June 05, 2011 12:05 PM)
Wow. So, based on your logic of people of the the same skin color killing each other, white people apparently have a lot of problems, too- The Hundred Years' War; The English Civil War; The French & Indian War; the American Revolution; the Napoleonic Wars; the War of 1812; the Civil War; the Franco-Prussian War; and World Wars I & II, the wars in Bosnia and the violence between the Irish and English.
There were blacks who owned slaves. And I'm sure at some point, a black man in the Confederacy fired a gun at a Union soldier. But black slaveowners and black Confederate soldiers are statistically insignificant to the stories of slavery, based on white supremacy, and the Civil War.
I think you make the mistake that many people make today- you try to understand the present without understanding the past. -
madetwolast — 14 years ago(June 06, 2011 10:26 AM)
Well, "Wow" to you, too. I understand both the present and the past indeed - and people are people. They'll do WHATEVER to get over. NOT all people, but ENOUGH. I don't care what color their skin is, but I'm black, so I'm saying what I know about SOME black people. I know there's bad people in EVERY race.
I'm a tad bit tired of people right now, if one hasn't noticed
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baeksu — 14 years ago(July 10, 2011 01:10 PM)
And let's not forget there were Black slave owners and traders as well. Let the liberals play a race card on that one.
It's amazing what people think is clever.
So there were black slaveowners. Obviously that means that slavery was ok? Or that whites are unfairly blamed for there being slavery in the U.S.? -
mspibb — 14 years ago(August 18, 2011 05:22 PM)
I've see the man who "re-enacts" the Black Confederate Soldier. Yes, there may have been individual moments when a body servant or other negro on the southern side fired a gun at the north but the reality is the southern government was too terrified of slave insurrection to arm them. Lee knew that the south was severely deficient in numbers of able bodied men and lobbied for black regiments but not until early 1865 did the southern government relent. There were black troops being trained in Richmond when it fell to the North.
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Zanza8 — 13 years ago(June 12, 2012 03:46 PM)
And let's not forget there were Black slave owners and traders as well.
Larry Koger wrote an excellent book on black slaveowners-it's available at Amazon. One of the points he makes, and I believe it's a very valid one, is that there were black slaveowners because the institution of slavery was such a powerful one that most people in the south thought it was right to use slavery as a means of making money. In other words, slavery was such a strong base to the economy that people of all colors deferred to it and defended it. Looked at in that light, it's not hard to believe that there were probably a number of blacks who preferred the status quo and tried to defend it.
http://thinkingoutloud-descartes.blogspot.com/ -
still_brooke1 — 13 years ago(July 04, 2012 02:54 PM)
Thanks Karneda for bringing this up!! I had no ideawell really I'd never thought of searching for this topic until I saw your question/post on here. I would assume the black men that fought for the confederate army were either forced or they were treated well (as well as slaves were to be treated) and felt fearful of freedom since they mostly were illiterate, and had no job training or skills. That's just my observation and opinion, not trying to sound racist or anything like that.
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silvercometred1 — 11 years ago(February 03, 2015 09:03 AM)
Southern Blacks fought for the Confederacy, just as did whites, and for many of the same reasons, it was their home, their families, and their sense of honor. The Yankee Barbarians invaded, butchered, burned, robbed and raped their way through our homeland. They did not discriminate; as to which race was their victim, regardless of their claims of fighting the war to free the slaves. Abraham Lincolns true purpose in fighting the war was his unyielding belief that those people had the absolute right to rule, despite the principles laid down in the Declaration of Independence.
The Yankees predominantly transported the slaves from Africa aboard U.S. Flag Ships, held them in bondage, and sold them to Southern Planters. In any case slavery would have ended, even had the Confederacy won their War for Independence. Abraham Lincoln could have bought the slaves, and freed them, at little or no cost in blood and devastation, and at a fraction the cost of the war.
The Black Confederate Soldier has been for the most part ignored by Yankee Historians, modern day political correctness has resulted in a willful ignorance as to the sense of duty, honor, faith and patriotism of these brave soldiers. It is not possible that I could do them justice, in posting this one small article that will be for others, but for now, consider these unsung heroes of the Confederacy and the sacrifice they made for the Cause.
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Private R.M. Doswell was hastening back to his unit after carrying an order when something attracted his attention. The young Virginian had just spotted one of the new Confederate companies of black soldiers, "a novel sight to me." the black Confederates were guarding a wagon train near Amelia Court House on the retreat from Richmond.
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Doswell reined in about 100 yards to the rear of the wagon train and watched in fascination as a Union cavalry regiment formed up to charge. The black Confederates fired their weapons like veterans and drove back the overconfident Federals. The horse soldiers re-formed for another charge. This time they broke up the wagon train and scattered the defenders. The black soldiers were captured and disarmed. Doswell suddenly realized his own danger and rode away without being noticed. The date was April 4, 1865. Five days later, Lee would surrender his Army of Northern Virginia at Appomattox Court House.
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The Courageous black soldiers who served in the various Northern armies have been much publicized and praised. Their brothers who fought for the South have been almost totally ignored. In actual fact, black Americans marched to war with the Southern armies from the very beginning in early 1861. In contrast, the Federal government refused to allow black men to serve in its ranks until well into the conflict. It was 1863 before the North began using black troops in any large number, and only then after considerable opposition.
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Why did black men become soldiers of the south? It is often forgotten that while slavery was the major underlying cause of the Civil War, its abolition was not the original objective of the US government. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, President Abraham Lincoln stated that he had "no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the states where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so." The attempts by overzealous generals such as John C. Fremont and David Hunter to free the slaves in the areas they occupied were promptly countermanded by Lincoln. The man in the White House had enough problems without pushing slave-owning Union loyalist in the critical border stares into the arms of secessionists.
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Many Northern soldiers felt the same way, declaring that they would stop fighting if the war turned into a crusade for abolition. Before crossing the Ohio River in 1861 into what would become West Virginia, Maj. Gen. George B. McClellan had issued a proclamation to reassure the inhabitants, "Not only will we abstain from such interference," he wrote, "but we will on the contrary with an iron hand crush any insurrection on their part." Even General Ulysses S. Grant had said that if he "thought this was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."
Faced with such an attitude from the hostile North, the black Southerners had little reason not to be loyal to their home section. The slaves had nothing to gain from a Northern victory, and free black men might actually stand to lose such rights and property as they already had.
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The 1860 census counted 240,747 "free Negroes" in the slave states, 15,000 more than lived in the free states to the north. Almost half a century earlier, free black Southerners had fought under Andrew Jackson to help defeat British invaders at the Battle of New Orleans. Not surprisingly, many also volunteered to defend their homes against the new threat from the North. No accurate record has been kept of black -
There_Is_No_Sayid — 11 years ago(February 28, 2015 09:40 PM)
No, there weren't any black Confederates. The Confederate army remained closed to black men. The Confederacy did make use of a lot of slave labor to build fortifications and to drive wagon trains and such. But these were slaves, not soldiers. The closest thing to "black Confederates" were personal slaves of some officers. These slaves might sometimes accompany their master to the front lines and sometimes might even have fought beside them in some sort of capacity. But they were slaves, not soldiers, and also took advantage of opportunities they might have had to escape.
Unless Alpert's covered in bacon grease, I don't think Hugo can track anything.