I was thoroughly enjoying this film right up until the scene when Diane Keaton and Woody Allen are in his apartment and
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Balthazar Bee — 15 years ago(June 25, 2010 11:03 AM)
Well put. I remember a professor, whom I liked and otherwise respected, using this portion of the script as an object lesson about artistic insensitivity, shifting social mores, or some such. I don't think more than a handful of us had been previously exposed to the movie, and I felt genuinely sorry for the unfornate majority.
I hate to be the guy to mention this film to one of these folks in subsequent years.
"Isn't that the one that tries to joke about rape?" Oy. Might as well spray paint "Culture Ignoramus" on your forehead, if you can make it fit.
"I was nowhere
near
Oakland!" -
card53 — 15 years ago(July 21, 2010 02:38 PM)
Political correctness has rendered laughter an inappropriate coping mechanism for life's ugliness. No, there was never anything funny about real-life rape, child molestation, spousal abuse, etc. But I think it was a healthier time when we could laugh at the inherent absurdity of such matters and could make fools of the nutcases who would commit such crimes. Even a film such as ARTHUR is culturally obsolete. Try making a film about a funny alcoholic today.
Yet it still seems acceptable to make drug jokes in contemporary films. For those who object to the rape joke in PIAS, keep in mind that such a joke would have been no more offensive at the time than "stoner dude" humor is today.
Sorry, but you can't demand that the past conform to today's standards and morals. -
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ShroudOfFrost — 15 years ago(October 02, 2010 08:29 AM)
Obviously you just watch mainstream movies, or are just talking about mainstream cinema couldn't handle something life Love at First Bite. However, filmmakers like Noah Baumbach and Charlie Kaufman still take audiences to places that big time Hollywood refuses to go. Or another great example is David Lynch. A lot of people didn't know how to take the comedy in Blue Velvet and Wild at Heart (and Wild at Heart had a light hearted rape scene).
hitrecord.org -
megArnold — 13 years ago(December 07, 2012 04:25 AM)
Allen: "What are you doing on Saturday?"
Girl: "Committing suicide."
Allen: "How about Friday?"
You apparently mean something different.
Grammar:
The difference between knowing your sh**
and knowing you're sh**. -
LightningLad — 14 years ago(August 24, 2011 10:53 AM)
Our culture's mentality will eventually shift, and one day it may seem very strange and even offensive that joking about rape would be considered almost as awful as actual rape. There is something a bit odd about how speech is put on the same level as actual atrocities. I've never found this scene offensive, and I'm someone who really can't stand watching scenes in movies that depict rape. I'll avoid a movie for the rest of my life if I know it has a rape scene, but a the second poster said, it's realistic for the purposes the movie because people often joke about taboo subjects, quite often because of an actual fear. The other thing is just that I never watch a Woody Allen movie from the perspective of believing the characters are supposed to be role models.
Reason is a pursuit, not a conclusion. -
paudie — 14 years ago(September 20, 2011 05:41 AM)
That conversation made me feel a bit uncomfortable but as someone said good friends could easily have a humourous conversation on such a subject.
However there is no way that a odern mainstream movie would include such a discussion.
You're an errand boy, sent by grocery clerks, to collect a bill -
rpniew — 14 years ago(March 15, 2012 08:45 AM)
I agree the "rape" discussion is obsolete. Rape is not funny. I'm currently directing a community theatre version of the play and have excised the whole section. I am sure that, given the opportunity, Allen would have rewritten it. The idea is to find a way to bring discussion of sex into to conversation and for the Allan character to be confused about the signals Linda is sending. However, there are better ways to get into the convesation.
I don't quite agree with the earlier poster about the "committing suicide" line. I never get the idea, as stonefaced as the girl is, that she is really contemplating suicide. I see it as a way to blow off Allan. -
megArnold — 13 years ago(December 07, 2012 04:26 AM)
The discussion isn't abouth whether rape is funny, but whether joking about it is funny.
Death isn't funny either, but joking about death is.
Grammar:
The difference between knowing your sh**
and knowing you're sh**. -
doctorcrimedog — 10 years ago(August 18, 2015 01:33 PM)
I think the difference there is that rape disproportionately affects women (prison notwithstanding), and is a trauma that's an aberration from the norm. Death, on the other hand, is something we're all equally stuck with, so we might as well make light of it as best we can as a coping mechanism (though obviously, the number of
other
people's deaths we'll experience will vary widely).
-There is no such word as "alot." -
banders46 — 13 years ago(December 12, 2012 08:03 AM)
Well said. I think the conversation also just reveals, in a funny way, Allan's fear about doing something wrong ("I was nowhere near Oakland!"), as if it were on the same level as rape, and Linda's general goofiness while drinking champagne. Anyway, I think Woody writes women well in some ways, but sometimes their lines sound more like Woody talking through them (I mean, come on, what woman would say the thing about possibly enjoying rape?). This also works well in a way, because all of his movies have that quality of taking place in the Woody persona's head. We're not really getting reality, just his perception of reality.
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Howlin Wolf — 13 years ago(May 30, 2012 05:07 AM)
I can't defend the viewpoint, but at the same time, it was interesting to hear people who think like that so, I would take a movie with a provocative and memorable discussion like that in it any time, over one where the characters simply spout bland platitudes.
Born when she kissed me, died when she left me, lived whilst she loved me -
banders46 — 13 years ago(December 20, 2012 06:07 PM)
I thought of this thread the other day when I watching an old "Simpsons" episode in which Homer almost hits Ned Flanders over the head with a wrench to get his football tickets. Yes, that's right, Homer Simpson, beloved by America, contemplates murder (or attempted murder) in order to score some football tickets. Now, surely if the Simpsons can make a joke about murder
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global_global — 13 years ago(December 29, 2012 01:21 PM)
I wonder if people actually comprehended this film.
Woody Allen had the hots for his friend's wife. Neurotic and paranoid, he went through all the ins and outs as to whether he could make a move. She mentions rape and he jumps.
He's so nervous and insecure that he places his situation (having the hots for a girl and not know if/how to make a move) with being an actual rapist.