Couldn't agreee more. Everyone is talking about experience but the Israeli's are probably heading for the top of the lea
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joshstonerr — 18 years ago(July 02, 2007 12:39 AM)
Hang on a minute Kaneus, the SBS has never been part of the SAS, the SAS are a British Army unit where the SB are a Royal Marine unit which of course falls under the Admiralty as well as under the direction of the DUKSF.
WE do have liaison Team members attached now and again as to coordinate and liaise probably we have to understand each other. There are at present No SB's attached to the Teams, although we have continued to work together in Poppyland.
The Seals as I understand grew out of the conflict in South East Asia. They may have looked at various SF units ideas and said "OK, that makes sense" but as far as I know that's as far as the help went. SEAL training and SAS/SBS training is completely different in intent and style as their glaring differences in ethos and operating patterns.
And on the SB being part of the SAS nah mate, although they were part of the logistical family WW2 during the SB was always a separate org with a separate commander and structure, I have to say that we did for a short time wear the Winged Sword, but that has to be attributed to the unending quest of the Stirling clan to create an effective SF! Old but recurring pride and politics aside. There are RM's that have transfered after selection to 22, but the unit's remain totally separate. RM SC's go to Hereford for UKSFS now, but continue training back at Poole after the Badge phase of Joint SF selection. The SC is proud to remain a RM and the SB is proud of it's own heritage and independence from it's larger cousin!!
BTW at any one time we have 10 -15 Boat troop Pongos down here too as we are an equal opportunities trainer although they are obviously misguided enough to join the 22
Take care don't say we are part of 22 again please, it's all kind's of upsetting to some of us! -
joshstonerr — 18 years ago(July 02, 2007 04:30 AM)
Gosh my friend we always wanted to be pictured as the Superman figure but the boss said wearing our underpants outside our uniform was unmilitary LOL
How are you going? I am going civy next year. A US Company and a nice little package in SD, so we should visit my mate at long last! Thats the real reason for my quick trip to CA but the family helped as an excuse and a great eye opener! Are you still on the Island? or Going strategic, now your rank is getting there!
Talked to Mac and he say's that Doesn't want to name the Bionic Frog either, just in case bloody politicallly corect bugger LOL. But he does say that you have his respect for coming back! He leave's us next Month and going somewhere dark LOL and I will miss him as beleive it or not we have the same sense of institutional humour and wind up hot buttons. If you come across him ask him about map reading and the TF1/2 checkpoint in the drop into the Avon valley, and how much he owes me??
Hope you are well
Take care and keep a weather eye
Josh -
tmw1885 — 18 years ago(August 30, 2007 12:09 AM)
Just to clarify a few things
SAS did help Delta with some of the initial training that they set up, such as their room-clearing methods, cataloged in Charles Haney's book "Inside Delta Force" but by no means completely trained them. In terms of the secret nature of both groups, much like the SAS, Delta members who have been active in combat operations are not allowed to show their faces in any photos or videos, and (maybe like SAS??) are not allowed to divulge which unit they are part of, merely that they are assigned at Fort Bragg.
The unit in GI Jane did not exist, it was a fictional unit that combined members from different services together, with a focus on BUD/S (SEAL) training.
As far as I can tell, based on books by Andy McNabb (Former SAS, captured and tortured during Desert Storm) the SAS selection isnt markedly tougher than Delta's, although it probably is tougher than BUD/S (In reference to the 22nd SAS regiment's selection) due to their more selective nature.
As far as I am aware, the 160th SOAR is in a league of its own, and were the first to pioneer the methods used to fly low level at night with only NVGs.
While the SAS has more combat experience, due in large part to the "Troubles" in Ireland, I have to go with Delta because the SAS has never faced the odds that Delta and the rest of Task Force Ranger faced in Mogadishu and inflicted that ratio of casaulties (around 1000 killed to 19 killed)
I also want to throw into the mix the CIA's Special Activities Division, its paramilitary branch, that is composed largely of ex-delta and SEALS -
richimorton — 17 years ago(November 06, 2008 11:55 AM)
HMAS Sam : "butthe french beat the brittish.then things just became brittish again". Er..wowEr..When ? i mean , EVER ??? C'mon !
Perhaps you are referring to 1066 ? Still not a French victory as the Normans were infact settled Vikings or 'Norse' people , hence 'Nor mans' who were a scary bunch who probably have descendents in the SAS today .
Back to the point - nobody has mentioned that the SAS prevented WWIII (again?) during Operation Desert Storm . The Isrealis were on the brink of war due to Scud attacks (thus destroying the Coalition/Saudi support) and only - AND I MEAN ONLY - stepped back once they had been convinced that the Special Forces sent to deal with the problem were infact the SAS . How is that for a reputation ? Isreali's know who's best !
That which does not Kill me makes me Stranger
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apollorjc — 18 years ago(October 29, 2007 10:24 PM)
I'll try my best to keep this as short as i can and refrain from adding all the background info b/c many others here have done so and done it very well. I just want to add that US Navy SEALS, British SAS, The Aussies SASR, USD OP-Delta all are outstanding and if i was phjysically able to be in the military in any of those countries i would be honoured to join and be accepted by any one of these groups. They are all absolutely incredible at what they do-some better at one mission than the next but in the end i think they are all equal essentially. (i do an enormous amount of reading about Spec-Ops so i have some knowledge).
also, Commander Marcinko is a Legend and Hero in my eyes!
Thanks y'all. Hope nobody slams me for my opinions.
Do not be a victim, Do not be a perpetrator,above all, Do not be a bystander -
marshall_plan02 — 11 years ago(September 23, 2014 11:20 AM)
Just to add to and/or clarify along with the aforementioned, SEALS are actually more parallel to the SBS (Special Boat Service), which is also the British equivalent of US Marine Force Recon since it is manned by select personnel of the Royal Marines.
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dubyahsrobotminion — 11 years ago(November 15, 2014 03:28 AM)
Do you realize the unevenness of your statement? SEALs compare to SBS and SBS compares to Marine Force Recon? In this case the entire statement is inaccurate.
SEAL scope compared to SBS scope is very different. SBS encompasses several units within US Naval Special Warfare to include SEAL Teams, SBTs and EOD. However SBS operate on a completely different scale and tempo. SBS can in no way be compared to Marine Force Recon. FORECONs scope is far more limited and specific than SBS. FORECON for instance have no organic boat capability aside from small inflatables like CRRC.
SBS selection is open to the entire male complement of the British Armed Forces. It is not limited to the RM. I did a exchange tour at RM Poole with SBS and did a DET on HMS Ocean with 42 Commando.
You're taking a dump and they call GQ do you pinch it off or finish your business?