Symbolism and Metaphors…Help?
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julitrotter — 17 years ago(May 30, 2008 08:23 PM)
I am cherokee indian and agree with most every comment you have received thus far. I am slso a Production Designer and need to get in touch with Robert Ziembicki to give him props on his ART! He is brilliant, so is the Director and Director of Photograpy! PROPS to all of those plus sound and sound designer!!!
Spiritualism comes in many forms and from the comments I have just read, everyone as a whole has hit the nail on the haed! Indian spirits, animals such as bears, deers, eagles, crows, etc. all have special powers in the spiritual realm and beliefs of the indians for centuries. Each have a different power and can lead you (depending on who you are at birth to believe your animal spirit guide will be) into the afterlife.
On a lighter note, I think Johnny Depp is hot and believe he also has some Cherokee Indian blood in him!
Oh, and check out the indie "Cigarettes" (I think was the title, with Iggy Pop, etc) I kinda sucked for me, but had some great symbolism, I hopelol -
scot-herrigel — 17 years ago(June 15, 2008 01:09 PM)
I would say that the movie is somewhat of a parallel to Dante's Divine Comedy, but with premises based more along the lines of William Blake's poetry and philosophy. To begin with, the fact that Blake is taken to an industrial town, run by a man named Dickens, and called "Machine". This is a reference to Blake's abhorrence of reason and system, which is symbolized most eloquently by the word machine, as well as possibly Dickens, in that his line of thought, as far as I know, was highly unimaginative; his books being centered mainly around industrial themes. The Indian, on the other hand, represents the savage, primal, uninhibited and liberal energies that Blake equated with imagination. All the bounty hunters and other like characters represent agents of the Machine, or reason, or, more broadly, generalization. This fact is verified in the scene right before Blake and the Indian cross the river, wherein Blake shoots the preacher after the Indian quotes an extremely poignant Blake line about the true nature of Christ and the Devil. Because Blake killed off the manifestations of the machine energy he was warranted a passage across the river and into the realm of the uninhibited primal energies, which in Blake's philosophy are highly synonymous with Paradise, (although, in the context of being considered a parallel to the Divine Comedy, this could also possibly be Purgatory).
I guess the killing of the Indian by the final white bounty hunter in the end - and vice versa- is indicative of the fact that some sort of a unity has been attained, wherein the contrary elements of reason and imagination cancel each other out, (Blake would refer to this as a return to the state of Albion, or the wholeness of an un-fallen man).
The fact that in the final scene Blake is carried out into a sea does not really add up with Blakean symbolism, though, because the sea, to Blake,symbolized the epitome of chaos - which is not really what this scene refers to. As such, I guess it will have to be concluded that the movie can be simultaneously interpreted under different contexts, and that this final scene could then possibly be the casting off from the solid ground of the self and entering into the mysterious realm of "the home of the spirits," (I would say that this correlates to Native American spirituality, which also reconciles the need for the tobacco with the story line in general). -
kathuria-nimit — 17 years ago(September 17, 2008 08:05 AM)
there seem to be quite a few people here who have read Dante's Divine Comedy, so can you please suggest a good translation for a novice like me (there is more than one translation at gutenberg, so couldn't make up my mind).
Please help. -
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hbadra2885 — 17 years ago(November 22, 2008 07:58 PM)
I saw this movie recently and have found it simply amazing for the depth, composition of photography, script, great acting and a haunting, unforgettable score.
I have also recently come across an interesting piece of trivia for this film, and have figured out one of the "inside jokes" of the movie.
I came across a tobacco twist at a small grocery store in southern Louisiana and in fact, this form of tobacco is for chewing rather than smoking. The "tobacco joke" where William Blake keeps stating that he does not smoke when asked if he has some tobacco ties into his lack of understanding. It's simply one more thing that he doesn't grasp even as he prepares for death. -
wam6571 — 17 years ago(November 22, 2008 10:55 PM)
I see that differently. In that departure scene Blake said "But I don't smoke" in an ironical manner. Just listen carefully to his voice and see his eyes while he's saying it. That line has been repeated several times before with a straight voice tone. Now it sounded different, like a joke between old friends who read each others' meanings. Like "I don't get it" said in the sense of "Now I understand."
Let me also remind you of this: "William Blake, I am sending you back to the place you have come from." "You mean, Cleveland?" -
KenMishima — 9 years ago(May 29, 2016 12:35 AM)
This. The final dialogues between Nobody and Blake were tongue-in-cheek. Blake was not spiritually unaware like he was earlier in the film at this point. He had already seen glimpses of the other side and even saw nature spirits at one point towards the end. The "You mean Cleveland?" line should've made it obvious that he was joking when he said he doesn't smoke, as he also would've known that form of tabacco was for chewing and not smoking.