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Innocent User — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 05:32 PM)
I'm not entirely sure what point you're trying to make, but as a general rule, Lindelof is garbage. However, with Prometheus, building on Spaihts' script, he was excellent.
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Innocent User — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 05:38 PM)
I know. Most people don't understand the movie, which of course would make it hard for them to enjoy it. It got a lot of hate on release, which I understood, given the way it was marketed during its creation and on release. Shame really.
It would have been received better, and perhaps understood more, if it hadn't been set in the Alien universe. I think that was its major mistake.
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∂³∑x² — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 05:49 PM)
I'm sure that being marketed as part of the Alien franchise did it some harm however I'm not sure that it wasn't without fault beyond that with some basic knowledge of science and how scientists operate being overlooked for whatever reason.
With Covenant they try to keep this theme of science and religion going but they focus more on the glorious ideas of faith than the mitigated realities of the observable and perhaps that would have been better balanced had both ideas been considered in parallel.
As is I loved Prometheus as a comedy. The only thing missing was Leslie Nielson (And I mean that for so many reasons). But alas, nobody else saw it as a comedy, least alone its creators and so it turns out that how I appreciate storytelling is completely different from how the apparent majority does.
But at least you guys have Mayo and Kermode to help guide you with how to spend your time enjoying yourselves
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Innocent User — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 05:56 PM)
What? What is Mayo and Kermode?
The movie isn't really about science and religion, per se, more about free will vs determinism.
You clearly didn't get it. And that's fine. Most people didn't. Most people don't even understand the myth, to be fair.
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∂³∑x² — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 06:12 PM)
Mayo is just Simon Mayo a radio DJ who talks about things but Mark Kermode is someone who he gets on to talk about the depth and majesty of movies which have just been released.
Both of them seemed really impressed with Prometheus and took advantage of their positions of authority on the matter to inform the British public (Who paid their wages) that it was a deep and insightful movie which carves out a chuck of the very essence of humanity and puts it on display for all to see.
As you've noted, I couldn't see it myself. I guess I'm just not smart enough. I'd love for people to try and help me out on that front. Maybe someone who is used to taking grand ideas and filtering them down to a small-minded individual, such as myself, for partially digestion in the hopes that perhaps that tiny spark might light something of the grandeur which is so prominent to those with the eyes to see it
Anywho's this Kermode guy got so into it that he adopted an Internet pseudonym "Movius Dudem" and wrote an extensive set of blog posts on the matter. I'm always hopeful that one day perhaps someone can encompass those many, many hours of work and make an idiots guide because otherwise that Kermode guy was just wasting his time and it seems like someone managed to get him to do just that by way of easy trolling
There are so many cruel people on the Internet who just want to waste people's lives and lie about things. I wonder why that is?
Anyway; free will, determination and the creation myth. Interesting takeaway form Prometheus
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Innocent User — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 09:16 PM)
This Kermode guy sounds smart and seems to derive pleasure from analysing movies. I like thinking about philosophical movies too. I'll have to check him out.
I don't think intelligence is the reason why people do, or do not understand the movie. It's probably more to do with the kind of art they've consumed before and the expectations they have for a Ridley Scott movie. Had Aronofsky, Bergman, Tarkovsky, or even Kubrick made Prometheus, people would have examined it closer and saw what was there to see.
If you understand the myth, an appreciation for the depth of the movie follows. The myth is essentially a way of telling people that life is not subject to free will, but is instead encoded with a "program" that governs it. Prometheus is punished for eternity for interfering with that program by gifting man intelligence (represented by their ability to create fire) and therefore granting them dominion over the rest of the animal kingdom.
In the movie, David accepts he is programmed, and knows that humans too are "programmed", but is confused by Shaw's belief that she is free to make choices.
Shaw's belief in the Christian god is tested to the extreme by the discovery of the engineers and the evidence that suggests they've been tampering with creation. Like David's master, they are guilty of Promethean arrogance.
Are they programming, or reprogramming? Although they are clearly messing around with life and playing god, their objective is ambiguous. However, Shaw's certainty in the face of such ambiguity, her lack of logic, intrigues David. She is deeply indoctrinated (programmed) by her Christian faith, yet she cannot see that her beliefs are governed by it. She cannot see that she quite obviously doesn't choose to believe; she has to believe, or her faith will be undermined and her entire belief system will collapse. She's a prisoner of her programming, just like David.
That summary omits many layers of the film, but I suspect they'd only be wasted on you, because you're programmed to insist the movie is garbage.
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∂³∑x² — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 09:27 PM)
It's certainly an interesting take Innocent User and one which I'll no doubt stay awake thinking of for weeks, months or even years to come
This whole notion of characters being trapped inside of a reality which they have no control over and are made to enact out as foreseen by a higher power which grants them the illusion of free will but which ultimately has been planned out for them all along is an interesting one
Had that higher power been able to tap into some sort of zeitgeist hysteria which affected audiences and had people consider their existential struggles we could have seen a paradigm shift in the human condition and an elevated sense of spiritual succession which could have brought all barriers down between the warring factions of our global society and brought about a divinesque order in our understanding of ourselves and each other.
It's a real shame that the cosmic joker decided to have everyone be deadpan with it
But perhaps that's the joke
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Bobby Tomlinson — 1 year ago(January 16, 2025 07:00 PM)
Well with luck they will hire him as the new EP on Corrie and then it will go completely to the dogs and they will finally just cancel it.
Also should we tell Dazed in this thread about our idea to all pool together for a house on Brookside Close and timeshare it?
WEE WILLY WILLY FIND ALL THE WAY HOME!
