What do G1 fans think about the Bay Transformer movies?
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flying_falcon — 15 years ago(April 25, 2010 11:32 AM)
You asked for an opinion on the Bay movies verses G1. Here we go and I won't be surprised if this gets a few answers in itself. As it has been stated they were based LOOSELY on the original but there are some differences that were made that I disliked myself. First let me compare some of the Transformers from the movies to there G1 counterparts.
Optimus Prime: In G1 he was actually 3 units. The Optimus Unit which we saw most of the time (The part that was his robot form) The Prime Unit which consisted of his trailer in vehicle form and Roller. I read a few years ago that the Primes, ie Optimus and Rodimus consisted most usually of the Optumis or Rodimus Unit and the Prime unit in this type of format. Also in the G1 I always Like Optimus as an 18 wheeler rather than like in the Bay movies as just a bobtail tractor. Notice that in most of the cartoon versions Optimus most usually consists in this type of format (Or in the ones I have seen but I do not claim to have every version. Also to me Opitmus is a Cab over Tractor rather than a conventional like we see in the Bay movie. If I am thinking right in G1 he was modeled after a Freightliner as well verses the Kenworth they modeled him after in the Bay Movie. However it is harder to distinguish between the makes of the Cab over truck than it is for the Conventinals.
Bumble Bee: Opinions may very but to me Bumble Bee and Cliff Jumper both were modeled after Volkwagon Beetles I mean come on you can't watch a G1 cartoon and say you don't see that. In my opinion they should have modeled him after a Volkswagon. I have to agree that Bumble Bee and Spike were friends but Bumble Bee is not the same.
Megatron: In some of the newer cartoon he is a Tank that I can deal with but in G1 he was gun that from the looks the toy I have to guess was modeled after a .44 Magnum Desert Eagle. (But I haven't seen the toy in many of years so I might be wrong there) Making him a ship was wrong I would have preferred it if they had found a way for him to find a tank to disguise himself as.
They did alright with Frenzy but I would have preferred Rumble myself.
Both Ratchet and Ironhide were modeled after Toyota Minvans Ratchet was a Ambulance and Ironhide was more of a passenger type but they were Toyota Minivans of the time nonetheless. In The movie Ironhide was modeled after a Hummer SUT and Ratchet I am not 100% sure what he was modeled after.
Starscream: was about the only that was accurately transferred over to the Movie but the voice actor (in my opinion was wrong).
The Bay Movies were ok but they didn't have the feel of the Transformers, however in my opinion they wanted to push some of the Project cars through the Movies which is why they felt the had to Change Ironhide so drastically as well as Bumble Bee. They did to Jazz and then killed him. But oh well -
home0006 — 15 years ago(August 27, 2010 10:18 AM)
Cliff Jumper wasn't a VW Beetle, he was supposedly a Porsche 924 Turbo.
Anyhow my feeling about it was I viewed the first Michael Bay Transformers movie as an introduction to the franchise for a new generation. I knew it wasn't going to be true to the origins so I kept that in mind going into it. Overall I would say it was satisfying for what it was. No where near a great movie, and as a G1 fan who grew up with them there were a lot of things I would have liked to be seen changed, but I viewed it as Transformers, not G1 Transformers. It was though a fun movie.
As for the second ROTF, I hated it. I went into it hoping they'd build upon the first movie expanding the role of the Transformers. It didn't. It stuck with the same formula as the first one, but rather than improving upon it by adding more character development of the Transformers everything I didn't like about the first movie was magnified such as adding meaningless irritating characters like his roommate, too many dog humping jokes, the stoned mother running around campus etc.
Much like the Wolverine movie, it seemed like they just threw Transformers in there because they felt they had to. They gave familiar names to Transformers but gave them 0 personality or even lines such as Arcee and Sideswipe-which is what people like about the Transformers. I don't love Hound because he's a green jeep. I love Hound because he's an interesting character who appreciates Earth and would like to know more about it. Same goes for Prowl, he's not my favorite character because he's a cop car. He's my favorite character because he's the most logical of all Autobots, and his ability to process things at such a high rate to calculate the highest probable logical outcome is what made him 2nd in command. Michael Bay doesn't seem to understand this about Transformers fans and only sees the Transformers themselves as "instruments of destruction" for big battle scenes. It seems the only Transformers they gave personalities to were the two annoying twins. There was a time when I was watching it that I totally forgot Ratchet was even in the movie.
Once Optimus dies in it, I generally stop watching the movie because it goes down hill fast. -
blackheart981 — 15 years ago(August 27, 2010 08:20 PM)
Bay obviously did not know how to make TFs. He had zero idea on how every character was like, so what do we do from this point on? Make pathetic excuses of human beings, dumb jokes, and blow everything up! The latter being his trademarker. I simply loathed the first TF film and had high hopes for the sequel, but boy was I even more wrong. I'm glad Megan Fox walked out/got fired because she doesn't have to be associated to a film that butchered Transformers or almost had nothing to do with Transformers.
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artimak — 15 years ago(August 29, 2010 10:42 PM)
Michael Bay doesn't seem to understand this about Transformers fans and only sees the Transformers themselves as "instruments of destruction" for big battle scenes
This is an excellent point - very well said.
I feel the exact same way - he sees them as tools to develop Sam's character - his maturation, his relationship with his girlfriend, his relationship with his parents, etc., etc., etc. He sees them as "other," as background support to offer aid or danger. Meanwhile, the protagonists are all clearly human.
By the way, Bay himself came up with most of the immature jokes and lines, including much of the dialogue for the retardo-twins. The reason they're featured so heavily (and have, unfortunately, the only real character development amongst the Autobots) is because they were/are his favorite characters - he said so in an interview. I wish I could say I'm just kidding (because some of my brain cells die every time I think about it), but I'm not - he seriously loves them. -
Banjo_oz — 15 years ago(May 12, 2010 07:29 AM)
Km9000 summed it up well; I'm sad that the CGI movies are the versions of TFs that most kids today will remember (part of why I was such a huge fan of Animated was that IMO that show was exactly what a "modernized"/"rebooted" TF show/franchise should be).
Bay's movies existing doesn't ruin my enjoyment of G1 Transformers (heck, I always far preferred the Marvel comics universe to the Sunbow cartoon anyway, even though I grew up with both of them as a kid), but I find it an awful movie from even an objective point of view, Transformers or otherwise.
It also might as well be a Go-Bots movie, because it doesn't FEEL like Transformers to me apart from Optimus Prime, none of the characters look, talk or resemble personality-wise ANY of their original namesakes it's really just a bunch of anonymous robot parts beating each other up.
And yes, the focus on humans makes the whole thing pointless anyway. TF: Animated (again) showed how you can involve humans a lot and still make a show about TFs. The original cartoon often focused on Spike and co, but it still never felt like it wasn't the TFs' own series. I don't mind humans in TF tales, but I DO mind when it becomes "TFs in human stories" (some of IDW's later comics spring to mind there too).
Bayformers, had it stuck to "a boy and his car who turns out to be an alien robot", could have worked but the stupid other Independence Day style cast of hackers, gung-ho army dudes, comical parents, black hat government agents, etc. were a total waste of time.
Simon Furman's 'Bay universe' comics are actually much truer to the originals we know and love, so it showed me that the writing has a LOT to do with it. Kurtzman and Orci were great fun writing for Xena and Hercules (they wrote some of the best episodes, especially of Herc!), but IMO they don't understand properties like Transformers (or Star Trek, for that matter) that they profess to be "fans" of, if these are the scripts they write. As someone once said "who the $%&@ hired these people?!" (in-joke for Herc fans
). -
artimak — 15 years ago(August 22, 2010 09:37 PM)
It also might as well be a Go-Bots movie, because it doesn't FEEL like Transformers to me apart from Optimus Prime, none of the characters look, talk or resemble personality-wise ANY of their original namesakes it's really just a bunch of anonymous robot parts beating each other up
Exactly.
Bayformers, had it stuck to "a boy and his car who turns out to be an alien robot", could have worked but the stupid other Independence Day style cast of hackers, gung-ho army dudes, comical parents, black hat government agents, etc. were a total waste of time
Well said.
I agree with 95% of your post. -
DamianGein — 15 years ago(October 14, 2010 02:56 PM)
Hmmm I liked the first movie a lot. Not so much the second one, explosion everywhere with no character development and it barely had a storyline ( if any)I grew up watching the original G1 ( though it's not my favorite TF series) and I think that the first one was a good entry to the Transformers franchise but that's about it.
You, will never realize, what darkness lies inside, inside my own mind -
jones82176 — 15 years ago(February 18, 2011 05:12 PM)
I hate them. Not so much because they are bad movies, but because I am 34 so the g1 cartoons, from 84-86 will always hold a special place in my heart. If you like the Bay movies, God bless you, you're entitled to your opinion, but they are NOT for me. I don't think putting them into a live action movie was a good idea at all anyway. The shows blatant disregard for size scale, as well as outdated technology, I mean, who carries a tape recorder anymore?, make this something that only works as a cartoon.
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Enigmatic-Ocean — 14 years ago(April 05, 2011 09:28 PM)
It's complete garbage! What the hell does Bay or Spielberg know about transformers?! Why on earth thoes two were put in charge of this franchise is beyond me. They should have gotten someone who would honor the source material. The robots should have looked kind of like their Action Master counterparts. Instead we got "Transformers" who looked more like Bionicles.
Get on the chew pipe! -
ryto_69 — 14 years ago(June 06, 2011 11:00 PM)
Several reason why I don't like them, I did enjoy the movies, but in review I thought the story and script were cheap crap.
I didn't like how they just took whatever they wanted from the transformers lore and mashed it together, especially use of certain quotes. It's like all they wanted was to use the transformers identity and use enough of the lore to give it credibility.
The humor in the movie.. awful.. really so awful.. is it really necessary to throw in cheap humor to cover up bad writing just to get us through the movie? Sure it's funny to the younger teenage viewers.. but I cringed in the first movie when the parents started talking about him locking his door so he could masturbate.. I mean really, couldn't you make the story more interesting without that? -
Blade27 — 14 years ago(August 04, 2011 05:55 PM)
http://insidemovies.ew.com/2011/08/03/transformers-dark-of-the-moon-cr osses-billion/
Cue the Michael Bay haters!
In whats becoming an increasingly common achievement in Hollywood, Transformers: Dark of the Moon crossed the $1 billion mark at the global box office on Tuesday, the films 35th day of release. In doing so, Dark of the Moon became the first film in the Transformers franchise to earn $1 billion (not surprisingly, its also the first one released in 3-D), as well as Paramounts first-ever $1 billion box office hit.
The robot-alien blockbuster, which has earned $338.8 million domestically and $663 million overseas, is the third film to surpass $1 billion this summer, following Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides and Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2.
That's bloody impressive!
Who's The More Foolish
The Fool, Or The Fool Who Follows Him? -
alekesam — 14 years ago(August 13, 2011 01:51 AM)
Lesee, how do I feel about Bay's TFs as a G1 fan? A G1 fan who ran home from the bus stop because it came on at 4pm and my school bus drops me off 4 blocks from my house at 3:55. Every day, I ran home so I could make it before it came on. The 86' movie I've seen so much I literally could quote it title to credits, complete with music cues and such. Which also introduced my favorite Con, Galvatron. I had the entire Marvel comic book series and quite a few of the toys that my folks could afford. With all that said, I say
I friggin' loved the live-action films! They weren't perfect, but there was much to like in the series, especially if you take it as being it's own thing, which seems to be the major problem people have with it (not being close enough to G1). Me, I'm glad they didn't ape the cartoon completely. None of that mass displacement (Soundwave/Blaster/Megatron being able to transform into something so small always bugged me as a kid) mess was in the live-action movie so that was a plus. Them only being able to transform into something of equal mass was brilliant. I also like them being able to scan their own forms as opposed to Teletran-1 doing it as each Transformer can fit their alt modes to their own personality and need. And it's not like they took non-descript robots and slapped TFs on it. Throughout the live action series, there are TFs lore and nods sprinkled throughout the series, just in some cases, it's a different interpretation of them. That shouldn't be a mark against it being different.
This next part will probably sound blasphemous but live-action movie Optimus is my preferred DESIGN (capped it so that people don't think I mean personality-wise just design-wise), flames and all, now. Same with Bumblebee. I liked the design choices that they made with the autobots as well as the decepticons (tho' admittedly, somenot allof the COn's could've used a little more work). They look like I always thought a live action TF would look like, gears and bolts and things, shiny parts, oil dried parts, constantly moving, and limber/lean, more like an anime mech (which themselves are usually well thought out in concept/practicality) and definetly, no liquid metal facesthey have jaws and sockets and joints. And despite what people say, unless you're 60, you can easily tell apart who is whom. I mean, they did something right because now in the comics, they still have their G1 forms, but way more detailed as a mechanoid of their advanced nature should be.
The humans were there to help not have the robots be in every scene for budgetary reasons. With that in your head going in, it smooths over the lack of Transformers presence in the first one. As the series progressed, we got more, which culminated in DotM. Lots of Tfs screen time and actually talking. DotM by far is the most TFs centric of the three.
So, in a nutshell, I loved the live action series and can't wait for the 4th one. To sum it all up, it's just another incarnation of my beloved TFs.
Just my one cent since I can't afford two. -
q_leo_rahman — 14 years ago(September 15, 2011 03:26 PM)
My first post on this thread. Fancy that.
Well IMHO the TFilms are flawed, but stunning. I pretty much agree on the points alekesam has brought up, but would like to put in my own thoughts.
TFans must please keep in mind that the movies represent an original continuity, separate from G1 but definitely inspired by it, as most TF shows have done before. So in this universe, we have the AllSpark, the Dynasty of Primes and the Fallen, and Sentinel Prime. Though loosely done (each film has its own continuity to make it easier for non-fans), its all fit together and explained in this link:
Michael Bay and Steven Spielberg worked hard to make the films a visual treat, as well as anchor them to reality. To that end, they tied in real-life events (Beagle 2, Seekers, Apollo), and took great pains to make the Transformers as realistic as possible (giving them multi-segmented, alien-looking designs). And to be fair, there were a load of production hassles: the budget limit meant only a few robots could appear out of the vast armada of Autobots/Deceptions, and also a deal with GM meant only GM vehicles could appear; there was also a writers strike, and
I will admit that the first film was awesome while the second and third films werent that good. The filmmakers did their best to make the films appeal to both TFans and non-fans (Id cut them slack on this alone given how unforgiving and difficult this is), but they made misjudgments in development in the sequels that really stuck with me and with other TFans: they placed too much focus on the human side of it, and they made the war uneven-sided, having a small Autobot army up against a vast armada of Decepticons, when the war is definitely even-sided.
Also of significant complaint is the misdirected characterization: Megatron is sidelined by his master, and then his co-conspirator; Starscream whines but never betrays, Bumblebee remains a mute throughout the trilogy; Wheeljack became a YinSen-Erskine ripoff, and most infamously Devastators you know.
On the plus side, you cant deny that once MBay actually focuses on the Tranformers and their battles (the main purpose of watching), then the films pick up and actually make great viewing. MBay revised the Transformers into badass automobiles/warriors, especially Ratchet and Bumblebee, and the VFX fights taking place, augmented by real-life destruction and explosions, was top-notch. On that level Michael Bay did not disappoint: seeing the Transformers in live-action was a dream come true.
On the whole, the TFilms, when they actually focus on the fighting robots, are great. But those parts are way too short for viewers and the other parts of the film, apart from backing up the VFX and action, are near-worthless and are only for sitting through between one fight and the next.
07/08/06 786 the sentinel of Allah has arrived. -
Lunchbox-3 — 10 years ago(December 22, 2015 06:43 PM)
None of that mass displacement (Soundwave/Blaster/Megatron being able to transform into something so small always bugged me as a kid) mess was in the live-action movie so that was a plus. Them only being able to transform into something of equal mass was brilliant.
Except for the Cube/Allspark which could transform from the size of a building to something the size and weight of a football.