You Know What Pisses Me Off
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centrd — 9 years ago(September 25, 2016 08:37 AM)
And racist vs non-racist.
To be honest, it's kind of freaked me outthat people, even in my own network of neighbors, family and friends, can be okay with Trump. I do not believe you can support that guy and not be racistor all of the other "ists" he is. It's sobering to me. I mean, when a few of my circle voted for Bush the first and second times, I was disappointed, but I didn't literally question them as human beings. With Trump, that's what's happening, I'm questioning their character. And I don't think I'll ever really get over it. To give a psycho the nuclear keys and justify it because of their own selfish wants, I just can't handle it. Also, I'm having trouble with anyone who refuses to vote for Hillary because they were Bernie supporters. If those people get Trump elected by default, I don't think I'll ever feel the same about them either.
First time in my life I've felt this way, but it's the first time we've had such an extreme and dangerous candidate for President. I'm not saying others haven't been dangerous, but people were duped by them. Trump is overt, he lets everyone know exactly what kind of despicable person he is, and still they're okay with it? That's a scary thing.
Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague. Vincent Van Gogh -
bab7410 — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 08:36 PM)
Thanks bitter now
However, didn't some oogly Trump look-alike http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/04/25/10/337B0C4800000578-0-image-a-50_1461577865946.jpg just manage to carry forth thy Breexit?? This thing is spreading ugh -
topper24hours — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 08:27 AM)
Nice guess, retard.
I'm sure your reading comprehension isn't up to taking on my challenge of looking at the "original", or you would've commented on that, you lame.
I watched enough to see that Lucifer is a creepy "child molester" type, NOT the badass from the comic, that is led by his incredible devious schemes, mechanations, & clever use of raw power.. as opposed to a horny creepy weirdo pervy guy that's not interesting or even more than two dimensional. I saw his his badass powerful & horrifically deformed bodyguard Mazikeen (oh, I'm sorry you call her "Maze", right?? Lol) is instead a weak female stripper/bartender type, etc, etc.
It's embarrassing as a premise and as a show.
The only thing worse?????
There are actually pathetic people that eat this worthless garbage up people that are NOT angry about the waste of an amazing character, that just eat the slop in their trough happily.
Please snort a six foot line of Ajax. Do the world a favor. -
barbarawstuller — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 08:55 AM)
Maybe if you wrote in comprehensive sentences and backed up your opinions with specific criticism of something, you could be taken more seriously. Instead reading your rambling, disjointed posts are more like trying to follow Trump's train of thought. Too painful to try to make sense of.
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iabanon — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 04:36 PM)
It's funny how every single one of us said we don't like trump and then he goes on to tell us we're Trump lovers. What a douche. I'm ten times smarter than this twerp. We all are. I mean all our posts are infinitely more understandable. But fanboys always take comics so damned seriously. Like it's the end of the world. And hey good shows are still being made (other than Lucifer so stick it) and I loved Constantine and was really bummed it was cancelled. It deserved to go further. I watch schyte this idiot wouldn't understand. He thinks he's so smart, but all he watches is comic book shows and all he reads (actually he only looks at pictures) is comic books. Guaranteed he hasn't read anything by Stephen Hawking or Carl Sagan. Guess what? i have. I own many books on Quantum science and other scientific areas and that's just for fun. GUARANTEED he's never read anything by Chekov or Dostoyevsky. I have a bookshelf full of these books. Fwck this twerp. He doesn't know anything.
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topper24hours — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 07:15 PM)
Lol, ok- I'll bite.
I'll take a genuine stab at it
I doubt I'll get anywhere with you if me making VERY clear statements describing how Mazikeen for example is a strong, ferocious, warrior of a bodyguard, w/ a horrific disfigured face in the source material, yet is a sexy, bland, stripper/bartender stereotype female in the show and that saddens and annoys me somehow comes off to you as "difficult to understand" or "incomplete sentences" or whatever your fictional problem was but here goes nothing:
Ok 1st- some background; the character of Lucifer Morningstar was created by author, Neil Gaiman. He is one of the most well known, admired, and prolific writers of this modern era. I'd say he's up there with J.K. Rowling and Stephen King. He has won some prestigious awards and medals, including: the Hugo, Nebula, and Bram Stoker awards.. and the Newberry and Carnegie medals (setting a record of the only author to ever win both medals for the same work). You don't seem like the "reading type", so I'm probably losing you
However, one of his books became Phil Knight's (the Nike founder) Laika film company's 1st foray into stop motion with "Coraline", which was well received. Also, his fantasy novel, "Stardust" became a film in 2007, starring Claire Danes, Michelle Pfeiffer, and Robert DeNiro.
At any rate. I would hope that we (if on nothing else) could agree that he is an author of quite some pedigree. In his most revered work: the comic book "Sandman" (widely recognized as the best and most successful American adult comic book, of all time), he created the character. Lucifer was SO interesting and such a fantastic spin on the "devil", that everyone cried for more!
The mantle was picked up by a superlatively creative Brit, by the name of Mike Carey.
Almost unbelievably, he spun a tale that was EXACTLY the same length of Gaiman's original seminal masterpiece. It was stellar. Seventy-five issues, at one per month, made this a 6+ year labor of love. It was so incredibly clever, the way small characters later play larger roles, how everything connected together so fluidly. It was a joy to read.
Understandably, I was ECSTATIC that such a phenomenal character was getting a TV series!!!!
Oooooh, what storyline?? Him abandoning hell? Losing his wings? His battles with Fenris, eater of worlds? His reluctance to do a favor for Heaven, that he simply MUST accept, because God lets him "name his price?". Honestly, I didn't care. They are ALL good!!!! WHAT A CHARACTER!!!! Strong. Savage. Impossibly clever. Old as time sees the big picture. Humans are tools to manipulate in his brilliant schemes and mechanations. Super fun character!
Soooooooo nothing even REMOTELY like the character in the show. The show's Lucifer is a "frat boy", somehow being alive for eons hasn't made him clever or caught up in grand schemes. Nope. He (like a frat boy but with an uber "creeper" vibe), he thinks only with his penis, and in no way seems like a powerful angel. Simply a creepy perv. Of the three or four episodes I shuddered through, hoping it would get better- I only saw lame clip after lame clip of BEYOND cheesy "quips" and one-liners. Usually accentuated with weird little moans in his speech, and not even like in clever or classy or appropriate times. Just rando stuff like if a female would say like: "we need to get down to business", his response might be: "oooooooooooh, slow moaning of word in creepy manner, raise of eyebrows in suggestive manner, we could DEFINITELY get down to business. the business of sleeping together. Mmmmmmmmmm one last creepy moan-word.
Ummm. WTF??????!!!!!
This is not MY Lucifer. This is not THE Lucifer.
This is painful to hear and/or watch. Drivel.
I've never watched Dawson's Creek, but apparently it was NOT the experience this writer needed to bring an amazing character like Lucifer from comic to television!
This show is really, really, really, really, really bad.
I was honestly worried that I was losing my mind when I saw it had decent ratings on IMDb. However, when I clicked the 1st critic review (New York Times - http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/25/arts/television/review-on-lucifer-a-fox-drama-the-devil-tries-to-fit-in.html), my faith was restored!
Seems like those with actual critical thinking skills similarly despised this garbage they didn't even need something epic to compare it to, to hate it!
It's only a huge group of sad, sad sacks that apparently have no ability to even conceive of anything better than this absolute horrendous garbage that are eating it up. It does make me sad sad that these type of TERRIBLE shows can proliferate, because nobody demands quality. The cattle are satisfied. They chew this nasty cud, ignorantly and happily.
I hope this helps. -
centrd — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 08:59 PM)
Most people here know about Neil Gaiman and some of us are well versed in his graphic novels and literary works. As well as Mike Carey's adaptation of Lucifer, and now Holly Black's.
Interestingly, Neil is a huge supporter of the show. He gets it, just like Mike Carey gets it, as stated in interviews.
It's too bad that you are blinded to the quality that's actually in this show because your expectations are not being met.
Regardless, it doesn't really matter. You're not going to change the opinions of the 7 million people, as well as the other writers and industry people who think it's a really well-done show, by ranting, belittling others and trying to show off your superior taste in comics. It just doesn't work that way, so I'm not really sure what you get out of it. Venting, I guess?
Also not sure what the Dawson's Creek problem is. Tom Kapinos also wrote Californication. Television writers write for all kinds of genres. And as teen genres go, Dawson's Creek was pretty well done. And it doesn't really matter because they're two totally different animals.
I could go on about how females are represented in this show as well, but it's already been discussed. You can look for it if you really want to hear another point of view on that topic.
Anyway, I appreciate you attempt at supporting your position and the slightly less hostile tone. Progress, I guess.
Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague. Vincent Van Gogh -
centrd — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 09:07 PM)
Oh also, Tom K was the creator of the concept. He only wrote the pilot. The Lucifer writers group take turns sharing writing credits on the rest of the episodes.
As for reviews. Those have changed considerably since those first ones that came out. The early reviewers succumbed to the hipster law of condescension before actually watching or understanding what the show was about. So there are many positive reviews and comic book podcasters that are fully onboard now. You might want to check them out.
Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague. Vincent Van Gogh -
readerf61 — 9 years ago(September 24, 2016 09:13 PM)
I'm surprised he never won an award for his scripts. I think The Doctor's Wife is one of my very favorite Doctor Who episodes.
I can understand your disappointment, but every beloved "source material" of mine that's been made into a movie or tv show, completely messes it up. Wait, I lie. Catch 22 and Slaughterhouse 5 are nearly perfect. But that was a long time ago. i think there is a (mis)conception now, that people don't want to see what they've read, or that people who haven't read it won't "get" it.
Railing against us, the fans of this show, will not change things. You must take it up with the network executives.
And Constantine wasn't that close to the source, either. It didn't help that the decision was made to show the episodes out of order, either. So, Constantine lost the comics' fans and the regular viewers that just got lost. Pity. -
topper24hours — 9 years ago(September 25, 2016 05:42 AM)
I appreciate the comments.
I must disagree with Constantine!
After the garbage film, the show was polar opposite he was Brit; he was a bastard didn't drive or use guns.
All four of those were messed up in the movie.
I thought it was a SPLENDID adaptation very true to roots. -
readerf61 — 9 years ago(September 30, 2016 11:03 AM)
I liked Constantine. But the comments from the comic readers.and I have to tell you, I'm almost embarrassed to write this.they were furious that he wasn't allowed to smoke on network tv. Even when a thread had nothing to do with that missing aspect from the comics, someone would bring it up.
So, much better than the movie, but still failed to satisfy a loud and vocal portion of the comic book readers. -
crusojalewhistef — 9 years ago(September 25, 2016 11:49 PM)
I somewhat understand your criticism. Maybe it helps that I'm not into comics but that certainly doesn't mean that I'm part of "cattle" I know exactly what I'm watching. This isnt Wishbone Magic School Bus or (if you want to use an adult show) Family Guy.
I know that Lucifer is supposed to be this extremely ruthless guy who doesn't care about humanity at all but that's just not how I see him (or wish to at least because I'm more pessimistic) I don't like nicey nice characters either though and I see Lucifer as someone who has layers (like Dr. House) and that's what Tom Ellis is demonstrating to me. He's not really evil but he's not angelic either. He certainly could be evil if he wanted to but he just doesn't want to beat least not to the innocent ones.
Yes he is dirty in this but not seeing the problem with that. I know this is supposed to be based on the comic (so the comic might not have that I'm guessing) but it appears to be also going off the less outlandish parts of biblical mythology and that would make sense as that is Lucifer's first origin. In the bible, premarital sex is a sin so it would stand to reason that Lucifer would be into that. Also sex is just one aspect. Lucifer so far hasn't killed anyone but he HAS done some significant damage. I would say throwing a guy out of a window the way he did was powerful. He could kill someone if he wanted to but the thing is he doesn't have to. All he has to do is look at them with red eyes and they're a complete puddle (which the red eyes do look cheesy but it would be difficult to make eyes in a live action series that would look scary enough but I can imagine they look a lot different to the person than to us the viewers) so I would say that's powerful and he was certainly not thinking with his other head when he scared that bully kid (nor was he when he saved Chloe's daughter because he had already seen Chloe naked and refused) How many creatures can make someone feel vulnerable just with their eyes? I know this seems like more of a meer party trick but the fact that he can get people to say their biggest desire no matter who they are shows that Lucifer can manipulate people how he wants to. Also there is no challenge to killing someone. They'd just get sent to hell and he is not in hell on here so why would that be any fun for him? He has tortured the ones who deserved it on this series.
Yes in the latest episodes he has been vulnerable but you wouldn't expect the devil to be vulnerable by anything and that is the appeal for the viewers. A lot of us find it intriguing that a certain woman can make the devil vulnerable so it adds an unpredictable nature. There must be something special about her that would do that and am excited to find what that is.
Superman had a weakness. Even some of the Greek gods in mythology had significant flaws so why can't Lucifer have a weakness?
As far as Mazikeen, I don't see bland but we will agree to disagree. I can see why you would say she is "sexy" and it is probably a cheap shot to appeal to viewers but it doesn't have to be that way. I think sexy can be a representation of a ferocious being because it can hypnotize the men she is going to attack and the other women can feel threatened by her appearance.
I try to live without regret but I'm about to break a sweat. -
kurt-2000 — 9 years ago(September 26, 2016 03:30 AM)
I know that Lucifer is supposed to be this extremely ruthless guy who doesn't care about humanity at all
Lucifer/Satan from the Christian Bible is the essence of all evil and total chaos. Not some"guy". Only comic book idiots would be interested in exploring the 'softer side of Satan'.
but that's just not how I see him (or wish to at least because I'm more pessimistic)
or more 'atheistic' perhaps was the word you were looking for?
I don't like nicey nice characters either though and I see Lucifer as someone who has layers (like Dr. House) and that's what Tom Ellis is demonstrating to me.
Which is kind of like saying: 'I'd like to explore the various shades of grey regarding child molestation.' Some people see Lucifer as the essence of evil. They just haven't bothered to show up on this message board in large numbers.
How many creatures can make someone feel vulnerable just with their eyes?
A cougar watching a jogger go by on the road.
Even some of the Greek gods in mythology had significant flaws so why can't Lucifer have a weakness?
Newsflash: a very large percentage of people in America believe in God and support the Bible, which is why many people see this show as stupid on an epic level. I personally just see it as junk food for the brain.
I think sexy can be a representation of a ferocious being because it can hypnotize the men she is going to attack and the other women can feel threatened by her appearance.
Women in these cheesecake roles aren't a threat except to their own careers. They're just seen as television's version of pole dancers. Can't get an honest job? hello? -
crusojalewhistef — 9 years ago(September 29, 2016 07:55 PM)
or more 'atheistic' perhaps was the word you were looking for?
Not in this sense. I was just saying I can't necessarily believe my envision because of my extreme pessimistic side so that's just how I'd wish to see him.
Newsflash: a very large percentage of people in America believe in God and support the Bible, which is why many people see this show as stupid on an epic level.
Right but from what I see most of the bible is essentially ancient toilet paper. It's not even junk food for the brain to me it's just plain junk that has no entertainment value (but I have researched specific passages to be informed enough to gain perspective). Of course I am an admirer of a musician who used to be devout so I have no problem with religious people but the concept has a lot of holes so I'm not worried about the zealots which is the only people who would find this show to be "stupid on an epic level" to the point they would be offended.
Some things make sense but a lot of it is utter tripe at best inhuman at worst (for example in the bible the punishment for rapists is to marry the one they raped) so while those people see Lucifer as the essence of evil I see their representation of god as the bad guy and Lucifer as the good (but not too good) guy. Of course I am strictly talking about their representation as I would like to envision neither one as a bad guy if they were real beings.
I try to live without regret but I'm about to break a sweat. -
kurt-2000 — 9 years ago(September 30, 2016 07:14 AM)
from what I see most of the bible is essentially ancient toilet paper.
Ouch. I can't say I'm a Christian or worthy of being called one, but even that was painful to read. And the board was previously discussing why some evangelicals took offense? lol
I'm not worried about the zealots which is the only people who would find this show to be "stupid on an epic level" to the point they would be offended.
Not that it's extremely important in context to this viewpoint exchange here, but the "zealots" are getting dangerously close to giving Trump a victory. Just an observation: Some zealots are of the opinion that networks like Fox entertainment should have their broadcasting licenses yanked. And Trump hates the media with a passion. Just thought I'd toss that out there as a side bar issue.
