Why did it so bad at the Box Office?!
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KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(November 09, 2004 07:46 PM)
- Can they pack just a few more cliches in there just to see if they can break the current record they hold for most shameless cliches in a movie?
- Nothing, absolutely nothing about this movie is original. The premise is a complete rip-off of 'Bourne Identity' (the 1980 Robert Ludlum novel) with some half-hearted attempts to make it seem new, which I suspect are rip-offs of other things I can't think of right now.
- The acting was horrible. Even the man Samuel L. Jackson didn't come through, though he did make this movie tolerable to watch the whole way through. Geena Davis, however, made me cringe everytime she turned into 'Charlie'.
- I see a huge .357 Magnum on the cover of a video, I set certain expectations as regards to the action. Needless to say, this movie didn't come close. It seemed like every action scene was filmed by someone who didn't know what they were doing and trying to make their movie like 'Die Hard'. I did like that part where the guy falls from the helicopter in flames. But it hardly made up for the other atrocities I had to sit through one hundred minutes before that.
- This movie is absolutely ridiculous! An unsuspecting, unarmed woman taking on a shotgun loaded with incidiary rounds wielded by a professional killer? Chasing down speeding cars on ice skates? A car escaping an explosion projected to kill four thousand people by driving away from GROUND ZERO in under a minute? Driven by a guy who's been bleeding out for at least fifteen minutes from a rifle round to the chest? And what does it take to kill people these days? Every main character should be dead at least three times over by the end of the movie. I know it's an action movie, but come on, there's a limit to how far I'm willing to go.
- The only way to make an over-the-top, overacting bad guy worse is to have multiple over-the-top, overacting bad guys and this movie has at least, what, three or four?
- There's no reason to care for these characters. Who cares if anyone lives or dies at the end? Of course, we know the good guys will live. Oh, come on, you knew it.
- This movie is the kind of movie I like to watch on TV. Something that has a lot of explosions and I can flip back and forth to if I want.
- Dialogue sucked.
- People were busy watching Pulp Fiction, Forrest Gump, Dumb and Dumber, Se7en, and a host of other great movies that were coming out on video. And I'm sure something was worth watching in theaters. I don't even remember this one coming out. I've only seen it in video stores.
And that's just ten reasons.
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KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(December 24, 2004 11:13 AM)
It's a very eye-opening experience, posting things here on IMDb and reading others' posts. I've always considered myself to be a rather objective person. Able to see both sides of the argument, understand where people were coming from. But now I'm accepting the fact that this is not true. I have absolutely no idea what people are talking about sometimes as I read their comments about movies. My best guess would be to say they are working with completely different criteria.
For instance, I have no point of reference for someone who would say the dialogue is terrific in 'Long Kiss Goodnight.' I'm sure even Shane Black would be taken aback at that comment. It's not even attempting to be good. It's supposed to be over the top cheeseball stuff. It's on the level of comic book dialogue. The entirety of the 'character development' dialogue is made up of one cliche answered by another or lame running jokes. Watch a movie that doesn't have any explosions in it and you'll get a taste of what real dialogue is.
Chasing down a car on a pair of iceskates is involving? 'Bourne Identity' doesn't even come close, then? Not even a smidgeon?
So I've given up being objective. -
KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(December 25, 2004 03:03 PM)
You mean to tell me you watch movies like 'Lost in Translation' and you consider the dialogue in 'Long Kiss Goodnight' not only tolerable but terrific? See, that's what I'm talking about incomprehensible. I'm not arguing that Mr. Black can write lively dialogue, I'm just saying the dialogue - like everything else in the movie - sucks. It's a solid one-star movie. And name-dropping isn't going to convince me you know what you're talking about.
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Alias_MFB — 21 years ago(December 30, 2004 07:45 PM)
fergman3001
has obviously seen
The Long Kiss Goodnight
more than once. His posts are full of details about the film. Now why would anyone subject himself to such torture? Could it be that this "one-star" film is actually far better? Yep, that's it.
There's no reason to care for these characters. Who cares if anyone lives or dies at the end? Of course, we know the good guys will live. Oh, come on, you knew it.
This isn't a valid critique of the film. You could probably make the same complaint about any drama.
The Long Kiss Goodnight
has a mom and her 9-year-old daughter. We can't help rooting for both of them. And even if we know they will prevail we can still enjoy the movie because we go for the whole, unfolding story and not just the ending.
It's a very eye-opening experience, posting things here on IMDb and reading others' posts. I've always considered myself to be a rather objective person. Able to see both sides of the argument, understand where people were coming from. But now I'm accepting the fact that this is not true. I have absolutely no idea what people are talking about sometimes as I read their comments about movies. My best guess would be to say they are working with completely different criteria.
Translation: If you enjoyed
The Long Kiss Goodnight
you must be some sort of lunatic.
fergman3001
beholds favorable remarks about the film, and now as a result he finds himself in a state of
anomie
. His entire world-view is upended. Hilarious! I hope this continues.
You mean to tell me you watch movies like 'Lost in Translation' and you consider the dialogue in 'Long Kiss Goodnight' not only tolerable but terrific? See, that's what I'm talking about incomprehensible.
We can't praise anything about
The Long Kiss Goodnight
if we also happen to enjoy the latest critics' favorite? Ridiculous. -
KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(January 10, 2005 06:49 AM)
I can't help it! I love seeing myself quoted!
My goodness, I feel very honored to have my words dwelt upon with such depth. All right, coming back down from my little cloud of joy . . .
Actually, I have only seen this movie once. And that was more than enough. I happened to post right after I watched it so it was rather fresh in the mind. And I don't really think you guys are lunatics, though that was the first thought that popped in my mind when I read the posts lauding The Long Kiss Goodnight. Films like this are a dime a dozen and you can get everything you see in Long Kiss Goodnight in some other movie. So I have difficulty understanding why anyone would defend it or wonder why it did badly at the box office. It didn't do well because . . . well, read the above reasons. Most audiences do not like movies like this. That's why it did badly at the box office.
And I don't think there is a movie made where you can't say at least one good thing about it. For instance, I really like the shot where the guy is hanging from the lights or whatever and things are exploding as the camera tracks Geena stalking towards something. I really did.
The point isn't that the movie has you rooting for a nine year-old daughter and mother (though personally, I wasn't), it's that there is no tension. They never throw you something that says, 'Hey, watch out, we might just kill them.' Every indication from the time that they outrun a grenade explosion is that they are totally invincible. It's like James Bond, right? Only less plausible. Plus, I actually care if James Bond dies. I couldn't care less for these characters. Especially Geena Davis once she turns butch.
Lastly, I could care less about the critics' opinion. I like a lot of movies critics hate, and hate a lot of movies critics love. But Lost in Translation is everything The Long Kiss Goodnight is not: quiet, unique, insightful, and immersive. I just have trouble seeing how someone could like both kinds of movies, and that's why I wrote that I have stopped thinking of myself as objective. I like my movies, you like yours and there doesn't seem to be any way to reconcile the views. So be it.
Lunatic. -
Alias_MFB — 21 years ago(January 13, 2005 08:31 PM)
Ooooh, wicked.
It's abundantly clear that you don't like
The Long Kiss Goodnight
. But you keep returning to this page to discuss it further. Fascinating.
I didn't like
American Beauty
. And, strange as it seems, I'm not even slightly interested in visiting the IMDb board for
American Beauty
. I'm not interested in discussing the film at all. I'm happy to simply forget it.
Now why don't you just turn your back on
The Long Kiss Goodnight
forever, including all discussions thereof? You've made your points. Aren't you content with that? -
KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(January 16, 2005 07:45 PM)
Because I can't let someone else have the last word!
Well, I don't have to go through too much agony cause I've got that cool thing going where IMDb sends you an email telling you if someone replied to one of your posts. So all I have to do is check my email and there it is! A reply by mfburk!
And I just like talking to people about movies. Especially movies I don't like. There's nothing worse than a board that only has glowing comments on it. These message boards aren't only for people who like the movie, they're also for people who really DISLIKE the movie. You should go to the American Beauty board and spice things up.
Plus, I've gotten into the habit of looking up every movie I see on IMDb as soon as I finish it, and I usually scan the most recent posts to look for something interesting. Of course, after I saw one of the worst action movies I've ever seen, then saw a thread called 'Why did it so bad at the Box Office?!,' how could I resist?
So there are all my reasons. And tell me if you post over in the American Beauty board so we can have another lovely discussion there. -
elandyll — 21 years ago(January 26, 2005 11:18 AM)
Ferg there's still one concept you seem to not have grabbed here.
It's called relativity. Not the Eintein principle, but the one that simply says "it's all relative".
You might want to consider that we are talking here about a "mindless action flick", which -on the premices of a Die Hard clone- actually delivers some pretty good scenes, decent script AND, yes, higher than average dialogues.
Again, it's all relative, -and subjective- and comparing this movie to the Bourne Identity movie(though very clearly TLKG is based "loosely" on the same novel) is like comparing Good morning Vietnam and Platoon. Same subject, two different takes.
I like both. -
KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(January 26, 2005 07:00 PM)
No, no, no. I'm not comparing 'Long Kiss Goodnight' to true masterpieces of film, or even just really good, entertaining movies like 'Bourne Identity.' I am judging it as it is - which, as you say, is a mindless action flick. I won't judge it as a Die Hard clone because once you're that, well, you're that and it's you're own fault. But, sure, I don't mind it being a mindless action flick. Wait, is 'Die Hard' a mindless action flick? Because if it is, I'm all for it. I love 'Die Hard.'
I am saying, no way. Not even for your run of the mill action movie is this a good script and 'yes, higher than average dialogues.' What are we talking about here that is above average? Did you guys see the director's cut or something? Just as a favor, could someone just quote a piece of dialogue that is above average? And I'll try to be fair. I'll think of it as 'above average for an action movie' above average. I will not compare it to any better movie. Just give me an example so I don't think you all are smoking the whacky weed while you're watching crappy movies like this one.
Here, it boils down to one point. Action movies have their place and I respect that place. I like a good action movie now and again. I don't see why action movies have to live up to their stereotype of cheesy and dumb all the time, but I'm willing to overlook most of their flaws just because I like the action. For instance, I really like 'Face/Off' in spite of the terrible dialogue and acting just because of that one shot when they fly off the boat in slow motion. I love that, and I overlook a lot of other things. But not only is 'Long Kiss Goonight' way more uninspired and way more cliched and way more cornball than 'Face/Off,' it also didn't give me as a viewer anything that I couldn't have gotten from another mindless action movie. What would I have missed if I hadn't seen 'Long Kiss Goodnight'? Besides these delightful conversations, of course.
And one more thing. If action movies are 'relatively' worse than every other kind of movie, why do you watch them? -
jps2 — 21 years ago(January 27, 2005 05:17 AM)
And one more thing. If action movies are 'relatively' worse than every other kind of movie, why do you watch them?
For instanse I came from night shift this morning, got a few hours of sleep and watched the movie. When you're wery tired you don't want to look at some long drama, you want something easy and entertaining. That's were action movies come to picture and Long kiss goodnight is to my opinion above average in that area.
I don't watch that much action but compared to few of the last I've seen this one was great. So what are the last ones? Van Helsing, Underworld and Strange days from which the last is the best but not even close to this one.
From Harlin I also liked Cliffhanger and Die Hard 2. -
Roy72 — 21 years ago(February 25, 2005 02:59 AM)
I watch this film now thinking of it more as a comedy/spoof rather than a straight action flick.
I think Jackson is hilarious in this though I think Gena Davis should have played it less seriously. e.g. when she steals the ciggarette from the boy she was funny and the director should have put more comic bits in for her. Instead you just keep waiting for Jackson to show up. -
KeithFerguson — 21 years ago(February 26, 2005 08:06 AM)
Yes, it could have been a parody if it didn't take itself so seriously. And you've got to communicate to me that it's a parody. Like 'Last Action Hero' did that well. Maybe a bit over-the-top, but at least I knew it wasn't serious.
And as for Jackson, I'll just watch 'Pulp Fiction' again.