was 'the rape' truly rape? -Comments welcome
-
Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — Mysterious Skin
missdestinyjade — 18 years ago(September 21, 2007 09:50 AM)
I was just thinking about "the rape", and was wondering if it can truly be considered rape. I mean if Neil wanted to press criminal charges could he? I'm not to sure. I mean the legal definition of rape(from the u.s department of justice website) is as follows:
Rape - Forced sexual intercourse including both psychological coercion as well as physical force. Forced sexual intercourse means vaginal, anal or oral penetration by the offender(s). This category also includes incidents where the penetration is from a foreign object such as a bottle. Includes attempted rapes, male as well as female victims and both heterosexual and homosexual rape. Attempted rape includes verbal threats of rape.
Now of course by this definition, it was indeed rape, seeing as though it was forced(we know that because we saw the entire situation/movie unfold.) We know about Neil's tragic childhood because we saw the movie, BUT WHAT IF this was a trial, and we were jurors? We weren't there, we didn't see what happened from beginning to end, all we know is that Neil claims to have been raped. From the definition above ^, it's an open and shut case. He forced himself onto Neil. But wait, the Defense will of course throw a wrench into that theory of "forced sexual intercourse". I mean look at the situation from the p.o.v. of the defense:
Neil is a prostitute who WILLINGLY got into the defendants vehicle, and went to the defendants home with ALL INTENTIONS of having sexual intercourse. While @ the defendant's home, Neil snorted cocaine WILLINGLY, and WILLINGLY removed his clothing and proceeded to have sexual relations/interaction with the defendant. Though the interaction was aggressive, up to this point there were NO objections on Neil's behalf. So okay fine, he did excuse himself to "use the restroom", where he had ample time to do what he had to do. The defendant came in (he didn't break in did he? i mean it is his house, bathroom and lock) and they proceeded to have AGGRESSIVE (but not forced) intercourse. Neil never yelled, asked for help, or resisted. There was no verbal threat to his life or the lives of his loved ones, he simply just went along with the situation.
Now of course the defense would have to come up with a logical explanation for beating neil with a shampoo bottle, but they can say that Neil was into that(people are into all kinds of different things).
Bottom line, i'm just saying that if this was real life and went to trial, the "rapist" would probably get off. (so to speak) I mean, i'm sure the defense would bring up Neil's life style and call him a drug abusing prostitute-hardly a model citizen or typical "victim", and Neil wouldn't stand a chance. Which is probably why in the film, he seems to bounce back so quickly. To have been "violated" just 24 hours earlier, he seemed fine, if not somewhat jovial when breaking into the coach's former house and swiping cookies.
I don't know, perhaps someone disagrees? I have no problem with hearing anyone's objections/opinions
Ojos que no ven, corazn que no siente.
What the eyes do not see the heart does not feel. -
icarusinbrazil — 18 years ago(September 23, 2007 04:48 PM)
Yes, it was a rape. When the victim is a prostitute, the jury might not be sympatheticbut the odds are they could find other victims to testify against the perpetrator. That scene was very difficult to watch.
-
equinoxxx — 12 years ago(April 07, 2013 06:35 AM)
It was a rape. No human being may be subjected to such brutality, regardless of the circumstances.
The scene was not only difficult to watch, but it was brilliant for the way it collapses inherent but rarely commented-upon social distinctions between male and female rape victims. Another scene with profound resonance was the one with the AIDs victim who just needed to be touched. -
startofend — 18 years ago(September 27, 2007 10:12 PM)
Yeah it was rape sure but he asked for it. And if you think this scene is hard to watch then you haven't seen what a real rape scene is. Watch the movie "Irreversible". The rape scene in this movie is remarkably real unlike some guy hovering over another guy with his legs in the air doing a pumping gesture. Its over 8 minutes long and what was this? Less than a minute. I don't post this to say anything bad about what people can watch or not watch I post this to say
"Yeah it was rape sure but he asked for it."
Cast the first stone and you will be mocked cast the last stone and you are glorified. -
mrparka — 18 years ago(October 02, 2007 07:11 PM)
i've seen Irreversible and for some reason this rape scene got to me more, i just came from viewing it for the first time, its still fresh in my head, i felt a similar feeling for only two more films irreversible and cannibal holocaust.
-
courtstone — 18 years ago(October 03, 2007 05:28 AM)
YES. That was rape. I doesn't matter how me get into the car, or was "willing". That type of brutality and force is rape. Personally I would NOT have gone with any guy that is telling me to "be quiet, shut up and don't say anything". That would have gave me an eerie feeling about this guy before we even got out the car.
But diving a little bit deeper into his actions: Was he acting that way towards Neil because he was a prostitute OR was he treating him that way because of 'his own' personal insecurities? Usually the guys that are extremely homophobic or hateful to gays are guys that are dealing with the very same feelings within themselves.
I heard of a guy (who lives a "straight" life), but he has sex with guys on occasion. He would meet them, talk to them and have sex with themand just as soon as he "finishes" he would almost go into a rage and physically hit them and beat them up. Very sad. But in order for a person do thatthey must really hate themselves and have a lot of insecurities that they just can't deal with. -
PnkRckBtch666 — 18 years ago(October 04, 2007 05:04 PM)
Ya know, teh rape scene in Irreversible just didnt do it for me. First of all, 9minutes of rape onscreen is ridiculously long, but it doesnt stay ridiculously disturbing, after a few minutes it lost its brash, in your face, horrible unpleasantness. I was bored by the end, like "Come on, he would have cum by now", but this one got to me, and yes it was rape. Whoever started this thread has experienced the same thing and has been writing it off as something other than rape for awhile, unfortunately, it was. Prostitute or not. And maybe he didnt scream and fight because he was so beep degraded and he knew there was nothing he could do but be still and just take it. So he did.
-
missdestinyjade — 18 years ago(October 07, 2007 09:52 AM)
"Whoever started this thread has experienced the same thing and has been writing it off as something other than rape for awhile, unfortunately, it was."
Uhno. I was-THANKFULLY-never raped,molested,felt up, manhandled, touched inappropriately or etc..
I started this thread just to get people talking and to truly see people's opinions on the matter. I personally do believe that it was rape but thought that maybe someone out there disagreed to a point. Anyway, i appreciate your thoughts even though your judgemental comments were way off base.
Ojos que no ven, corazn que no siente.
What the eyes do not see the heart does not feel. -
possum_y3k — 17 years ago(June 03, 2008 02:47 AM)
He was forcefully beep up the ass.
How can that not be rape? Okay he put himself in a bad situation, but that doesn't mean he deserved it.
If a girl goes into a club full of guys wearing a short skirt and gets raped, some might say she was "asking for it", but she would still have been raped. -
laurie001 — 18 years ago(November 11, 2007 09:19 PM)
back to the original question, of course it was rape. Would he be prosecuted in court?
Of course not.
Justice systems all across the world are exceptionally prejudice against prostitutes of any kind. The rape prosecution percentages in the UK and the US are mind-bogglingly tiny. And they're even smaller for prositutes being raped. Just as it happens in the movie, in real life a prostitute wouldn't even consider going to the authorities- There'd simply be no point. -
gluba2000 — 18 years ago(December 30, 2007 06:10 PM)
It wasn't Neil's fault. Nobody asks to get raped.
You never know what you'll do if you're raped. Some people fight whereas others just freeze up and block out till it's done.
"87% of the Caucasion Persuasion has got it goin' on."
Wonder Showzen -
phasmatrope — 17 years ago(March 07, 2009 02:50 AM)
You've got to be kidding me I don't see how you could not see that scene as rape. If you've locked a door and someone picks it (even in their own house), then immediately proceeds to force themself on you while you're face down in a bathtub while hitting you, that's not exactly consensual, pal.
If the victim was a woman, you'd have NO doubt in your mind that it was rape.