http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/girlfairy.htm
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — FairyTale: A True Story
tracy3185 — 20 years ago(March 24, 2006 01:11 AM)
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/girlfairy.htm
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/fairy.htm
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/gnome.htm
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/fairs.htm
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/sunbath.htm
***This site has quite a bit of info on the whole situation.
http://www.cottingleyconnect.org.uk/fairies.htm#photosThe Story In 1916/17 Frances Griffiths and Elsie Wright, two young girls living in Cottingley, produced the most famous fairy pictures in Britain which are still talked about today. The first photograph was taken in July 1917 and showed Frances with the fairies. Frances and Elsie had been teased about their story of seeing fairies near Cottingley Beck. Elsie borrowed her father's quarter plate camera ,which he set to 1/50s at f/11 for her, and after some rudimentary instruction on how to operate it, she went off with Frances into the area where the beck ran among the trees behind the family home. An hour later they returned triumphant. When Mr. Arthur Wright (one of the earliest qualified electrical engineers), and Elsie went into the dark room that evening to develop the plate, there were the fairies. Arthur asked what those bits of paper were doing on the picture? The second photograph of the gnome resulted in the girls being banned from borrowing the camera again. The photographs were put away by Mr. Wright in a drawer as he considered them to be pranks. (Mrs. Wright was convinced of their authenticity.) In 1918 Frances wrote to her friend Johanna Parvin in South Africa and enclosed a copy of the photograph. On the back of the photo she had written 'Elsie and I are friendly with the beck fairies. Funny, I never used to see them in Africa. It must be too hot for them there. The letter from Frances ran thus: '. . . all think the war will be over in a few days, we are going to get our flags to hang up in our bedroom. I am sending you two photos, both of me, one is me in a bathing costume in our back yard, uncle Arthur took that, while the other is me with some fairies up the beck, Elsie took that one. Rosebud is as fat as ever and I have made her some new clothes. How are Teddy and dolly?' In her letter to Johanna, Frances was more interested in talking about the war and her dolls and the photo with the fairies was given but scant and matter of fact reporting. As if seeing fairies was to her an every day occurrence of little importance. Three years later Mrs Wright went to a folklore lecture in Bradford with a friend. This lecture included references to fairies and following the lecture in conversation with her friend mentioned the fairy pictures. They were overheard by a friend of Edward Gardner, a leading theosophist, and Edward asked to see them. Fred Barlow, a leading authority on psychic photography, commented to Gardner in June 1920 - 'I am inclined to think, in the absence of more detailed particulars, that the photograph showing the four dancing fairies is not what it is claimed to be.' and in December 1920 - 'I am returning herewith the three fairy photographs you very kindly loaned to me, and have no hesitation in announcing them as the most wonderful and interesting results I have ever seen.' Gardner sought a photographer who had the ability to examine the photographs fully and so it was that Harold Snelling came to his notice. He was informed that 'What Snelling doesn't know about faked photographs isn't worth knowing.' Snelling's considered judgement, in his letter to Edward Gardner of July 31 1920, was 'These two negatives are entirely genuine unfaked photographs of single exposure, open-air work, show movement in all the fairy figures, and there is no trace whatever of studio work involving card or paper models, dark backgrounds, painted figures, etc. In my opinion, they are both straight untouched pictures.' Mr. Gardner asked Snelling to make contact positives and two lantern slides of the photographs. These lantern slides were shown by him at a lantern lecture at Mortimer Halls, London. Through this the photographs came to the notice of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle. On hearing of Mr. Snelling's opinion, it was proposed, and agreed, that if the negatives survived a second expert's judgment, preferably Kodak's, then Edward Gardner and Conan Doyle should join forces and make the photographs a leading feature in the Strand article. Accordingly an appointment was made with Kodak's manager. They were received by Mr. West, the manager. His studio chief and two other expert photographers were also present. The negatives were examined by all at some length, and the results of the inspection were as follows, all agreeing. (1) The negatives are single exposure. (2) The plates show no sign of being faked work, but that cannot be taken as conclusive evidence of genuineness. (3) Kodak's were not willing to give any certificate c -
tracy3185 — 20 years ago(March 24, 2006 01:26 AM)
Here is some more info from that site.
Where are the negatives and photographs now?
In 1972 Stewart Sanderson of Leeds University persuaded Leslie Gardner (son of E. L. Gardner) to donate Cottingley Fairy correspondence and the five glass plates of the fairies to the Brotherton Collection at Leeds University, where they are still housed.
In 1998 Geoffrey Crawley's collection of Cottingley Fairy Photographs, two of the cameras used by the girls, 3 sketches by Elsie of Cottingley Fairies, a letter from Elsie to Geoffrey Crawley (1988) and a book 'The Coming of the Fairies' by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (1st Edition 1922) were purchased by public subscription and are held at the National Museum of Photography Film and Television at Bradford. These are all available to be viewed and there are frequent gallery talks about them. The cameras etc and a reproduction of one of the photographs are on display in their Kodak Gallery on the history of popular photography. The photographs themselves are housed in Insight - their Collections and Research Centre and anyone who wishes to is welcome to make an appointment to go and see them. This can be done via their website: (www.nmpft.org.uk/insight/apenqfaq_menu.asp) or by getting in touch in person.
1998 Two lots of fairy artefacts (probably Frances' collection) were purchased from Sothebys by a London bookseller. Both were sold on to private buyers in America.
In 2001, An 84-year old photographic archive relating to the celebrated Cottingley Fairies hoax fetched 6,000 at auction. The collection of glass plates and other negatives, was bought by an unnamed buyer at the Bonhams & Brooks auction in London's Knightsbridge. The archive consisted of master copies of the original photographs along with a three-page commentary by Gardner, who commissioned photography experts to prove that the pictures were not faked. It included previously unpublished pictures of Elsie and Frances holding hands and posing with Arthur and Polly Wright. Gardner had passed this collection on to the British Theosophical Society, from where they were handed down to a series of owners until their present owner (reportedly Hodson) put them up for sale.
The only known surviving contact print from the original Arthur Wright negative (unfortunately very frail and not in very good condition) is owned by J. Mawson.
Other copies which were given to friends by Elsie and Frances remain in private ownership. It is not known how many of these still exist
Some Unanswered Questions
If the images were cut outs of either paper or card how were they disposed of without anyone noticing?
Wouldn't Elsie's father have searched high and low for any clues?
Cut outs would leave mutilated magazines or remnants from paper drawings - why were none found?
Surely it would be difficult for children to make sure all traces were disposed of without anyone noticing.
Pictures cut out of paper or card always show the white edge of the paper - anyone practising decoupage knows this
How were the wings made transparent?
Why didn't the hat pins show through paper or thin card?
Is it believable that all the photos were taken without any hitches? It would be difficult to get rid of any "mistakes" with the type of plates and film used at that time.
-Tracy
This is me..
http://www.myspace.com/tracy3185 -
Belletrist0 — 19 years ago(April 28, 2006 07:45 PM)
I'll give a go at answering some of the questions:
If the images were cut outs of either paper or card how were they disposed of without anyone noticing?
After the girls were done photographing their fairies, they dropped the cutouts into the beck. They may have done the same with any scrap paper, or they may have burned any scraps, which was frequently done back in those times.
Wouldn't Elsie's father have searched high and low for any clues?
Both Elsie's father and mother searched their rooms, but never found anything. Although Mrs. Wright was a firm believer of the fairies and the supernatural in general, Mr. Wright always knew that it was a trick, and instructed Elsie never to accept monetary gifts, lest the day come that the girls would be exposed and accused of trying to scam in money.
Cut outs would leave mutilated magazines or remnants from paper drawings - why were none found?
See question one above. The fairies were all drawn by hand, and disposed of in the water after the girls were done with them. Any other evidence was probably burned, or hidden outside of the house until such time when it could be safely disposed of.
Surely it would be difficult for children to make sure all traces were disposed of without anyone noticing.
It depends. The girls had a little alcove all to themselves, and they spent all their time there, talking, drawing, and sleeping. None of the adults bothered them. Furthermore, when the original photos were taken, no one was expecting any fairies, and so searching for any evidence
after
the fact, was a bit of a moot idea.
Why didn't the hat pins show through paper or thin card?
The hat pins did show, especially on the gnome photographed. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle claimed it was the gnome's bellybutton, go figure. Decades later, an adult Frances would say that she would always look at those photographs and cringe when she would see the hat pins sticking through.
Is it believable that all the photos were taken without any hitches? It would be difficult to get rid of any "mistakes" with the type of plates and film used at that time.
Some of the photos did have hitches. The gnome photo has a slight slant, giving Elsie the appearance of abnormally long hands. The last photo of the fairies bathing was a double exposure, and the first photograph of Frances and the dancing fairies was so bright, that the fairies did not even show up, until the photograph was retouched.
Everyone dies but not everyone gets to live. -
Hecate-3 — 19 years ago(September 20, 2006 07:32 PM)
An English country estate would certainly have a working fireplace, but I seem to recall that Elsie said something about disposing of the drawings in the beck. But she probably burned the scraps from the cutouts.
BTW, Elsie was 15 or 16 years old when the pictures were taken. She was not a small child. At the time, she was considered a young woman. Indeed, she had a job outside the home and drew a salary. IIRC, she had been working as an assistant in a photographer's studio. -
stevie-quinn — 19 years ago(November 20, 2006 01:04 PM)
I read a great article on this - I cannot recall where - it was many years ago, but there are some more photos that were found in an old box many years later. These show the hoax really as they were photos that were under or over-exposed by Elsie who had full access to the darkroom.
They were left lying with all the original literature etc. These are publish photographs - or have been at least once and as I say I've seen them.
Still a warm story though. -
i_like_flapjacks — 19 years ago(April 28, 2006 09:51 AM)
Has anyone read the curious incident of the dog at nighttime by mark haddon? It said that Sir Arthut Conan Doyle (Author of Sherlock Holmes), wrote in an article how he believed it was true.
"Children - there's a time and place for ever thing, it's called college" - chef -
v_v_60 — 19 years ago(May 02, 2006 12:13 PM)
This was sooo interesting thankyou for for posting it. I can remember seeing one of the girls (very old lady}interviewed on Nationwide many many years ago when i was about thirteen always fascinated me, they asked her at the end of the interview if any of it was true and my mum turned it off quickly and said to my sister and me lets not find out some things are best left as a mystery!! I was miffed at the time but totally agree with her now.
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corimcd — 19 years ago(September 11, 2006 10:35 AM)
.Frances was born 1907 and following the fairy affair returned to South Africa. She always maintained that at least one of the photos was not fake. She died in 1986
Do you know , or does anyone know, which photo that would be??
I also wonder how they did the leaping fairy photo ? -
corimcd — 19 years ago(December 31, 2006 12:20 PM)
Sorry it took me so long to get back here.
thank you for answering my question nieko-ner.
That photo does look somewhat different compared to others.
I wonder why she said that one was real ?
This story really interests me. I hope to find some books
on the subject.
thanks again -
SnowMoonFalling — 19 years ago(January 13, 2007 07:03 AM)
Although I'm fond of faeriesand like to believe in themI never thought the photos were real. The posted pictures, above, are very clear and I have to wonder how grown people would judge them as Real, even if a little unbalanced by grief. They are so obviously faked. You can't blame the girlsit would seem to me to have been a private thing that the adults ran away with. I always thought it made Conan-Doyle rather an a**.
Nevertheless I think this is a cute movie and one of the better ones for children.
"Blame is for God and small children."Louis Degas
Papillon -
Horseman123 — 19 years ago(November 05, 2006 08:15 AM)
The photos are so obviously fake. I mean look at them. Why is it that all the faries are flat? They aren't three dimensional like the girls are. Even when you look at the faries closer you see a black dot from where the pin sticking out is. Why is it that none of these photos have faries behind her? Around her? Why are they always infront? You can tell this is a posing photograph. Just like when you pose for a picture everyone is in front. This was clearly set up. Why is it there is never more than one photo for each section? For example the one where there are fairies dancing infront of her. Why is there only one picture for that? It seems they only took one picture in a different area, planning it out. If these fairies were indeed moving and dancing around her there would be no problem taking numerous pictures. They clearly took time setting up things so they couldn't take as many pictures.
I mean for petes sake people look at the freaking paper cutouts. They are just horrible. The legs don't equal eachother. The arms are disproportionate to the body. In some of these pictures one foot is bigger than the other and when you look at the legs and wings they are rigid and not smooth.
And gosh their faces. I mean c'mon people, their faces are litterally dots. Some people may so oh it's because they are smaller so you can't really see. But if these were indeed people we would see alot more detail. I mean look at their faces! It's just black dots for shadow! And in one of the pictures the lady doesn't even have a mouth! -
ForeverMagicle — 19 years ago(March 17, 2007 12:11 PM)
I think it's very possible that they really did see fairies.
Maybe some of the photos were fakes because they just needed some sort of proof so that people would believe them. (It's also possible there not fakes)
And when one of the girls confessed that it was a hoax she could have just been pretending it was a hoax so that people would leave her alone.
And one of those photos looks very real to me.
I don't know about all of you, but that's what I think. -
baileypinkrose — 19 years ago(March 18, 2007 04:41 AM)
I think what we had here were incredible young artists with great imaginations. I saw a painting that one of the girls did and it was full of detail, it was colorful and just amazing.
Not to say that fairies aren't real, though. I do have to say the one with the sunbath, the fairies do look 3 dementional. And that is the one the girl maintained was the only real picture. I guess you would only really know if you saw one yourself.
"If I had no sense of humor, I would long ago have committed suicide."-Gandhi